Uneducated teachers

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I find this topic very interesting and on a personal note quite timely!
I am not a trained teacher, rather a trained neuro educator and qualified midwife paediatric nurse. I have operated early years (pre three) classes for more than 15 years in Hong Kong (all of those children are accompanied by a parent or caregiver as per the social welfare ordinance). After many years of parents requests to start a kindergarten I am finally from September co operating with a local kindergarten to offer places to our playgroup graduates and begin a K1 class (I already have another kindergarten out of Hong KOng, operated by a business parter with a B.ED and Dip T). The first thing I did was employ a curriculum advisor, experienced in Early Years with relevant qualifications and experience in setting up an International school (she has a B.Ed in early childhood and a Dip T and currently studying her Masters in Early Years education). The second thing I did was advertise and begin the task of getting qualified teachers (regardless of the fact it is Kindergarten - the children deserve qualified teachers).
Here my shock began! The amount of people applying for the position (with no qualifications) was astounding. Granted the cv's I cited were exceptional with experience, some had even held administrative and head positions. I continued the process of interviewing and really wondered if I was expecting too much to get a qualified teacher while so many came with glowing references from well known kindergatens all over Hong Kong and some had even had experience writing their own curriculums - all with no relevant professional teaching qulification.
Fortunately for me patience paid off and I have been fortunate to employ two well qualified, experienced educators registered with EDB and excited to impliment our well written and meaningful curriculum.
This week has been the week that has made me smile and feel relieved that I held on to get the trained staff. They are working together to set up the classrooms, library and playground to reflect our curriculum, they are planning the weeks routine around our learning objectives and they are talking in a professional language all of their own!
I am a mother of four, I have always expected qualified teachers from kindergarten through. The children deserve this. I am sad to say however that I personally believe that many parents are unaware of just how many unqualified teachers are teaching out there.
Unfortunately (from a kindergarten perspective) a lot of dammage can be done if the foundation stage is taught incorrectly and I am sure there are countless reception and P1 teachers that will agree that all the decoding of bad habits takes up valuable teaching time when the children get to primary.
 
Totally weigh in with Quasi and Cupcakes here. I'm a DipTeach, BEd, DipChildLit, MPsych, train teachers and write educational resources and teach. I'm no longer shocked by some of your stories - seen it gong on for years in HK. Education is a money maker so many places not set up by educationalists. So bottom line is cutting costs to make a profit = cheap teachers = unqualified English speakers. The "can't get a job in HK so I'll teach" or " I graduated with honors from a US university in ......( insert a degree/masters other than teaching) so I'll set up a writing centre" syndrome negates the recruitment montage "best person for the job".
I DO know all ESF and top tier international schools would never hire an unqualified, less than 2 years experience teacher - there are on or 2 exceptions. Lower tier internationals and locally owned or government schools are a different matter. Local schools that go through the ED receive a BEd or PGDE, many local schools just get the monetary grant from ED and recruit themselves. Kindergartens are privately owned. They are beginning to demand Early Childhood qualifications but when the pay is so much lower than that of primary teachers - which is lower than secondary ( local schools here) the best applicants don't bother and insulting.
Hong Kong needs to rethink its whole educational approach to valuing all areas and levels of education and recruiting educators with globally acceptable qualifications and experience.
 
Fully agree Elise. I am so bothered right now by the standard of teaching at my school. I am an excellent teacher, I have had fantastic experiences with a variety of schools/curriculums in different countries as well as developed curriculum myself. Unqualified teachers really lack the core of this profession. One problem I have with my school is that the principal acts and treats the unqualified teachers like they are the bee's knees. Honestly, this can only be because they are Caucasian, and are cheap. Why do parents spend sooo much money on their child's education in HK when the teachers can be so cheap and uneducated themselves?
 
I also believe that many people who are unable to gain reputable professions in their home country DO come to Hk because it is so easy for them to set up a 'learning centre/play group.' SO many teachers I know would never be allowed to teach at any level in their home country.
 
Absolutely, Cupcakes! It is all a game in HK. Management is old fashioned so if you can suck up to the 'boss', so much the better. If you can't play the game, you're left on the outer. A good teacher would rise above it and just get out of there at contract's end. I've even had the 'you're too qualified' excuse - seen unqualified people step in. I work privately now and continually have to undo what unqualified teachers have taught (eg. comprehension where you read the text twice and NEVER allowed to revisit it again). Degree in Accountancy + online TEFL does not a teacher make. Saying that, some people have a natural vocation for teaching and with the proper training would be amongst the professions' best.
 
It certainly is a game - it is all about what people can get away with. In my experience management only care about the bottom line. Little do parents know about the background of teachers!!!
 
I would really like to bring this to the attention of the media....and the unwitting public.
 
So, by some previous posters' reasoning:
1) homeschooling should be outlawed UNLESS the parents are qualified teachers
2) for that matter, parents are children's first and most influential teachers, so they, too, should probably be qualified teachers...

I know that I'm taking this to an extreme, but really, that is in essence what it is you are saying, isn't it? NO ONE who is not "properly qualified" should be teaching your child.

So, for soccer classes, we should ONLY have professionally qualified coaches? Same for ballet? What about an art class?

Or are you limiting your requirements to primary & secondary schools? Except cupcakes has already insinuated that I shouldn't be teaching playgroups, I have no idea what I'm doing and that I am only in it for the $. I take great exception to this insinuation.
 
It is my personal and professional opinion that anyone who 'teaches' children in Hong Kong should in fact be qualified in teaching and police checked. Why do some countries have rigorous requirements to meet when it comes to teaching and not Hong KOng?
 
"I am really baffled at the number of uneducated teachers in HK. I know, that where I am from, to teach kindergarten, you must at least have a degree in Early Childhood. Here it seems, to me, that anyone who speaks English can teach. I have been a teacher for over 15 years and it always surprises me that here, schools and parents allow un-educated teachers teach their little ones." (Cupcake)

To begin with, even if a teacher does not have a teaching degree, this does not warrant the label 'uneducated'. You could have a Masters in Education but never have set foot inside a classroom. Secondly, I do not know where you are from, but it wasn't until fairly recently (ie. within the last 20 years) that other Western countries required teaching degrees/diplomas for all teaching staff. In the UK and Australia, it wasn't until the early 90's that all secondary staff were held to this standards, and it slowly trickled down as we became more and more aware of the importance of early education.

Hong Kong is not quick to change (skyline notwithstanding) - but the EDB is slowly 'catching up' to the standards held elsewhere. Based on my experience, close to 100% of staff at International schools in HK are registered teachers (for which you MUST have an educational qualification). Local schools are slowly changing - all people wanting to teach in a school must complete a PGCE (or equivalent).

You get entrenched staff anywhere: and you get staff who have great qualifications and zero ability to communicate with students in a classroom.

You have to remember that the kind of staff you are demanding come with a very particular price tag - and many people simply cannot afford to pay it.

I think it's also really important to be clear when you are discussing matters of language and ethnicity and country-of-origin exactly what the context is. Native English speakers do not all speak the same way, nor do they all follow the same rules or grammar. By the same token, there are 'local' graduates teaching English who may have wonderful grammar and syntax.

Education vs Experience is always a tricky one. In my experience, my education did not necessarily prepare me for all the demands of teaching in a classroom - there is certainly something to be said for on-the-job training! I do not know a teacher who does not say that they learned more in their first year of teaching than they did in their teaching degree/diploma.

Perhaps I say this from a teacher's perspective, but most parents I know do not need to ask about qualifications, because they can tell if a teacher is doing their job well or poorly. Benchmarks are great, but not everyone fits the same pigeonhole.

I fully support police checks, and believe me, they are coming. The EBD is just trying to work out how to administer a system where a good proportion of the teaching workforce has spent time in multiple countries/outside of HK. After several high profile cases involving staff at both local and ESF/International schools, it's on their radar.
 
There is certainly something to be said about on the job training- absolutely - but this must be coupled with TEACHING education. From my point of view, at my school, this is not. The problem I see at my school, is that parents DO NOT know if their child is being taught correctly.. That is my point. Parents think that just because their child is coming home happy - that they are being taught correctly! Not so.

(Also, from where I am from it is a requirement to spend a significant amount of time in the class room if they are to attain an MEd).

I am all for police checks
 
Cara - yes, you are taking it to an extreme. We never mentioned parents and sports coaches here. The teaching profession instantly acknowledges parents as the child's first teacher, and then they work as a team!

HappyV - don't know where you're from but speaking for myself - my DipTeach and BEd all required practical classroom experience - graduated 1979. I was practical teaching in my first year of university at 18. Practicums ( in length and expectations) steadily increased throughout my 4 years. UK is very much like Australia. I train teachers now. Many in local schools only have certificates. As I mentioned, lowered tiered international schools ideally would like BEds+ but their pay, demands and style of management are less than acceptable.
As I also mentioned, there is no need for parents to march up to their ESF or top tier international schools tomorrow requesting teachers' credentials. Good schools provide ongoing professional development for teachers and teacher monitoring is effectively implemented.
The use of the word 'uneducated' by the OP was unfortunate.
 
Again I agree with you Elise. When I said 'uneducated', I meant not educated in terms of the teaching profession. Some teachers CAN be very well qualified for example in science, but have NEVER studied how to actually teach.
 
I understand what you are saying with regards to best teachers having high price tags but have you seen the charges at most international kindergartens/primary/secondary schools? The least that the school could provide for all that money is "qualified" teachers.
 
I know - you would think that having the best teachers would be the first thing to be on the budget. But, no. Premisses (looks) would be the first on my school's budget. Teacher's salary comes so far down the line. I should explain that I teach for a very well regarded International School.
 
Elise - I wasn't referring to the standard of training, but that there were not such strict policies on teachers until the end of the 1980s. Where I am from, even government schools did not have 100% 'trained' staff at this time (and from what I understand, it was similar in other countries, especially once you got outside the core academic curriculum).

Cupcakes - no one can teach you how to teach. They can teach you the philosophy, paradigms and practices that underlie teaching, but they cannot tell you how to deal with 30 recalcitrant students in a classroom. That's why I value experience almost as much as the piece of paper. I'd take 20+ years of experience working with children over a piece of paper from a second rate university any day.
 
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