Would you move to HK again?

W

whendg

Registered User
I know this question will probably get the "It's a matter of personal preference" type answers but I want to ask anyway.
My husband is currently being pursued for a job in Hong Kong. We're still getting all the info on it but we do know it will not be an ExPat package, it instead will be a Local Package, which we know is not as "desireable" as the ExPat. Anyway! My question is...those of you who have been living in Hong Kong for a while, what are your thoughts? If the pieces fall into place should we do it? Uproot ourselves (and our 2-year old) and head around the world (we are in Florida) and move to Hong Kong? Would you do it again?
I am equal parts terrified and excited. I am game for the experience and think it would be great for my son, but it is also crazy over-whelming!
I have been lurking around on the GeoBaby site reading old posts on moving, living, schooling in Hong Kong and it helps to know that there is such a great, knowledgable community intact to help out if things progress.
Thanks for any thoughts, advice, input you might have.
~wendy~
 
I'm on a local package, and my husband is kinda on a local package, too. We've been here more than a decade and are very happy.
The only difference is really one of hard, cold cash. Expat packages often include allowances for housing and English-language schools -- maybe flight tickets back and forth. But if you have a well-paid local package that is generous enough to include good housing / education / travel, it's basically the same. If you have a lowly paid local package, it can be a struggle -- but that's the same in any big city. Money buys comfort.
If you don't mind my asking, how much will you get per month? This will help people here figure out if you can afford a nice home in a nice neighborhood, etc.
Also, what level of living are you used to? Do you expect a giant apartment with private outdoor space? Do you want full-time housekeeping / nanny? Do you want a car? Top private schools? Are you interested in being part of expat high-society and hang out at expensive restaurants and bars downtown?
Or are you happy living in a modest-sized flat, cooking at home and taking public transport?
It all comes down to salary and lifestyle.
 
Thanks for your qiuck reply. We haven't gotten all the specifics on salary yet so I am not sure on the number. We would be dealing with a more modest lifestyle though, which suites me just fine.
My inquiry is more in the way of "If you knew then, what you know now about HK, would you still have moved?" Your comment on having been in HK for ten years and that you are very happy is a big help!
~wendy~
 
I wished we had stayed in Hong Kong continuously instead of moving back and forth between Hong Kong and Singapore five times in the last ten years. It would have been better for us professionally and financially as we would have been able to buy a larger flat in Hong Kong than instead of now. At that time, we thought it would be better to raise our children in Singapore and took the risk of moving where we thought we would be able to pursue our careers while having more open space, larger apartments and bilingual schools. Instead, we both lost our jobs during the financial crisis. Thank God we managed to have completely paid up our home in Singapore or we could have been in serious financial hardship. My husband is now the sole breadwinner on a non-expat package with a rental allowance, but no educational or travelling allowance. We've found we were able to make do by being very diligent in our research for housing, schooling and shopping to maximize our dollar - we have a large family, with three children 6 and under, my parents and a helper. We've found that Hong Kong can be inexpensive if you're willing to "go local". The difference between prices aimed at the expatriate market and the local market can be staggering. After all, half of Hong Kong lives in public housing where there are very low maximum income thresholds. Depending on your line of work, Hong Kong is a pretty hard place to beat in terms of career trajectory. I would probably still be working if I remained in Hong Kong, but we're still happy with being in Hong Kong on a single income.
 
We are living in HK for more than 4 years now, it was planned for only 2... and just signed for 3 more. We have 2 kids, one going to preschool and the other is only 11 months old.
If we had to leave it would be really hard, because we've learned to love this city, and have no regret at all about our move here. It's a very exciting city, with lots of energy, of possibilities, of new friends. And we could come back in a blink !
 
We moved here from shenzhen across the border, 2 yrs ago. It was amazing to move here instead of stay in sz which I hated. We are moving to Canada next month. I don't know if i would come back. Never say never but I would suspect not. One of the main reasons we are leaving is because of our kids, 2 yo and 4 mo. We are a single income family, living in a more local urban area(I'm the only whitey mama around;). We live in a modest 3 bedroom 800 sqft apt in a reasonably nice complex. Rent is $14.5k, covered by my husbands company. The portion of his salary we live on is $18k. Technically an expat package(don't laugh, ppl!) bc we have insurance as well, but my husband is not high level and works for Japanese company so conditions are different. For the past 6 months, I have been overspending bc of doctors bills when I was pregnant, helper salary(pt), moving costs, sons play school, etc. We eat at home mon-fir, but most weekend meals are out. Most bills are $200-300, except breakfast. I would say we are half expat-half local in terms of spending habits, possibly more local, hehe. We can't afford school for the kids. I think the company supports half but not till primary school, and that's far off. So that is a main reason. We also get bored on the weekends. No car, public transport takes long to go to far place. No family here. Couple close friends but not huge community compared with some expats here. Weather is ok, but a bit muggy hot in summer. I will miss the food, and all the cheap stuff you can buy. I will miss my couple of close friends too, of course. And living in a foreign culture. But there are other thngs that bug me here. I don't want to be an English teacher and get a helper to raise my kids.
Anyway, I would only come back if we got fed up, bored or failed in Canada and were offered a proper expat package. The school thing here is a real bummer though.
Sorry for choppy post, 2 monkeys around me:)
All the best in your decision. I'm all for going for it and moving overseas. We are just doing the reverse after many years away.
 
We have been here 14 months, 2 kids aged 4 and 2 and we would definitely do it again. While every place has it's drawbacks, we love it here and plan to stay here a little while (3 years +). We also went to the UK from Australia as expats and although we also loved that found it harder as it took longer to establish a social network - here I have found it really easy as there are so many ways to meet people.
 
I'm from the US originally and I've only been in Hong Kong 6 months so I may not be the best person, but I've been living in Asia for 10 years now including Singapore and Shanghai. I have to say I find Hong Kong a difficult transition and with a baby on the way even more so.

The things that bug me the most here is value for money of things like apartments, restaurants, private healthcare, and baby stuff. It's all ridiculously expensive if you want/expect the same quality as in the US. Even when you can afford it, you wonder isn't it crazy to spend $40USD a person on a very mediocre, typical dinner or $30USD+ on a set of bottles that costs less than $10usd back home.

Also, if you have a 2 year old, school will be a huge cost here. Others can probably tell you the exact price, but if you want an international preschool/school I've heard it's about 20,000+USD/year. However, the public school starts at 3 years old with half days if you are ok with that route. Tutoring is also very costly at about 500hkd + per hour.

The population and building density is also hard to stomach after living in other places. You can definitely avoid this if you want to live in areas like Discovery Bay, Lantau or Lamma Island, etc and they have cheaper apts. Additionally, I feel money is very important here. More than I've felt in other countries I've lived in. Maybe it's because things are more expensive here or people have more money in general. I'm not really sure. I just feel like there is a huge pressure here to spend alot of money to do anything.

For pros, help is cheap here (about 60hkd per hour for part-time and I think 4000/month for a live-in) and transportation is really good and cheap for buses, tram, and subway. It's also easy to get alot of Western groceries and ingredients here compared to other Asian countries. Finally, it's nice for hiking and beaches.

With a little one on the way, we see our time in Hong Kong as limited by school age, unless a job change gives us a full expat package with education, but even then we'd like to raise our kids in a place where we have a backyard and they know what running barefoot on grass feels like. I've literally seen a kid cry every time their feet touched grass because they were so freaked out by the feeling... And now that I think if it, I can't think of anyplace I've been in Hong Kong island where a kid could even walk on grass.
 
We've been in HK for 5 years now and I love it. My husband was born here but grew up in Australia. We decided to come back after we were married in Australia to be closer to his Dad. We came with my husband fresh out of uni on a local package. Compared to locals, we are well off, but we make fractions of what many expats make!!! It's all relative though and there's always someone better off than yourself. We're content :)

I would move to Hong Kong again in a heart beat. There are so many things I love about it. It hasn't always been easy - we have had two kids here, one with significant health issues. We had 18 months which we were unable to fly due to health reasons - it was awful being "stuck" here... but now that that's all behind us, I'm back to loving it again :)
 
Just wanted to add that after living in 6 different countries over the last 12 years, I love living abroad and think it's a really valuable experience for everyone including kids! So, I wholeheartedly endorse living abroad in general, I just think there are better places to live than in Hong Kong in terms of quality of life if you're not here to make alot of money.

That said, if this is your only option and you're looking for something new and exciting, I think Hong Kong is great place to start with as it's very English friendly and westernized compared to other Asian cities. I've heard it (and Singapore) called Asia for Beginners :P
 
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We have lived in Hong Kong for 3 years and are relocating back to Australia this month.

As you said, it does come down to personal choice, what you are used to, and what lifestyle you want to lead (I have never been to Florida so can't compare).

Is it possible for you to do a trip here before making your decision - I would strongly recommend that as it will provide you with a good feel for the place. If you get that opportunity, get a property agent to show you properties in your price range, recommend schooling, walk through supermarkets, baby stores etc. And ask yourself - what is your reason for moving, adventure?, financial?, career opportunities?.

There are many pro's, and many cons of Hong Kong (like many other places I guess). Pro's - Hong Kong has offered us a lifestyle we would never have had in Australia, we have a wonderful network of friends, we have home help which allows us to have a night life, and makes life generally easier at home. We have been able to experience a very different culture (we love the locals), international travel is so cheap (compared to Oz) and such beautiful locations close by like Thailand, Japan etc. And of course, everything is so convenient (taxis are cheap, everything is close by, delivery everything, internet shopping for everything etc).

The biggest con is definitely the pollution. We live in a large complex which looks out over the water and sometimes I can't even bear to look out the window a I still can't get over how polluted it is and it makes me feel guilty that I am exposing my children to it (they are 2 and 3). Also, as it is all vertical living, and such a huge population in such a small space, for me my children are so sick, all the time. I have been told by the doc that it must be environmental (we are honestly in there at least fortnightly, if not more often) and when they get a cough for example, it lasts for weeks. We have taken them to Europe and back to Australia for large periods of time and they all of a sudden get better and not sick again until we return here. To be honest, I know so many people who have left here due to their childrens respiratory problems. Other small cons is that HK does feel quite congested (it is so busy and built up), the only way to escape is by plane, or a train into China, no road trip holidays. And I really don't like the quality or range of food. Plus, compared to many other western cities I have been to, I feel it is quite dirty (maybe it's not, but it just feels that way with the pollution and smelly streets).

Would we do it all again?? Although we have enjoyed our time here, and are grateful for the 'adventure', knowing what I know about my child's health here, the answer is No. And my husband is on a pretty generous package where we get decent accommodation (2300 sqf), full schooling covered, private health etc, along with a max 15% tax rate (compared to 45% in Australia) not even that would keep me here. If you asked my husband though, if it wasn't for the kids health, he wouldn't have left. HK is buzzing with business opportunities and growth, all my girlfriends husbands love it here and never want to leave.

Sorry to be so blunt and maybe a little over negative, but just my thoughts. I really look forward to returning to clean air, blue skies, walking my children down the road to parks with green grass, large supermarkets with amazing selection of products (and regular stock), being able to see the stars and moon every night, reasonably priced products (I find everything here extremely over expensive), back yards, nice (pollution free) beaches, road trips and a variety of stores catering to all walks of life (not just the choice of Market quality vs top end 'LV & Bulgari' options, and nothing in between).

good luck with the decision - try and get here beforehand for your own personal thoughts! It is upto you and you will find many differing opinions here.
 
i moved here 16+ years ago as a single, just out of university girl. i am now married to a local, run/own 2 playgroup centres, own a dog boarding business and have 2 wonderful kids.

would i move here again? in a heartbeat without a second thought!
do i miss "home"? every day (especially miss my mum!)

for living, i could NEVEFR live on hk island or in the built up areas anymore. i've been there, done that and grown out of it.
we're now about to sign a lease out in the new territories (we've lived everywhere) about 39 minutes from central by MTR (subway) that has a 4000' garden & a private swimming pool. the rent is crazy expensive (for us) but compared to what friends pay on hk isalnd, it's cheap! ~ $40k/month. we are not on a local package or an expat package. we are both self-employed and only get paid when business is good. we don't have private med coverage. we are happy to utilise the gov't medical services that are virtually free (once you have a HKID then you are eligible to use them too!), we have no housing allowance whatsoever and we pay for our kids edcuation ourselves, so we've again decided to make use of the local system and so far are extremely happy with the choice.
 
Wow! Such a great collection of replies. Thank you all so much for your opinions. My husband is meeting with the HR group tomorrow so I am hoping to have more info. We have been told we'll get a trip over to check things out if things progress (my husband has been before, but not me) and I had already thought of checking out some places, walking around as if I was living there, going to the store, etc. and would love to visit some schools (I already have a list going) since my little one will turn 3 in August.
Definitely an exciting time! I feel a lot better knowing that meeting some great moms won't be a problem!
Thanks again.
~wendy~
 
Hi wendy how did the meeting with HR go, I am originally from The UK I went to university in Florida moved to hong kong seven years ago and now have a 9 month old daughter and am still here. Would I do it again definitely. You'll definitely find it different from Florida although the temperatures will be similar for you. But it's easy to meet people, how much you choose to spend on living is more flexible than most imply. After seven years we have just moved to Clearwater bay to have more space and a back garden. Thus makes the commute to work 45 minutes which I'll bet is better than your commute in Florida. The large international supermarket is 10 mins away. If you want to live on the island house prices are high but you'll find you spend a lot of time out.
 
Remember it doesn't have to be forever if you like it you can stay otherwise you head home with two years or experience you wouldn't have had otherwise . Good luck
 
"Other small cons is that HK does feel quite congested (it is so busy and built up), the only way to escape is by plane, or a train into China, no road trip holidays. And I really don't like the quality or range of food. Plus, compared to many other western cities I have been to, I feel it is quite dirty (maybe it's not, but it just feels that way with the pollution and smelly streets)."

this is so not true and unnecessary (the part that you need to escape by plane or train). there are MANY, MANY places to live in hk that are NOT built up at all! we just signed a lease for a place and from our window we can see: huge fields, jungle, mountains....only 2 small (3 story) village houses!

of course, if you choose to live on hk island it will be built up, but to make it sound like that is all there is is not true and does hk a huge dis-service.

as for pollution, i agree, it can be absolutely disgusting. but then there are times like this past week where it's been absolutely beautiful out! the worst pollution is in the winter as the winds come from the north and bring all of the pearl river delta pollution with it. in the summer, the winds shift and come from the south, from over the south china sea and they bring lovely, but hot weather.

the other reason that your kids might be sick more often is simply the population density in hk. there are a LOT of people in hk and most are crowded into a tiny area. but it IS possible to escape that simply by moving to the new territories.

don't get me wrong, you do raise some valid issues but to imply that it is impossible to circumvent any of them is not accurate.
 
We have moved back three times and this is our first on an 'expat' package of any kind. My answer is yes. Even on most local packages tax in your home country means you will get more here!

With a two year old you don't have a lot more time left before you need to stay put for education purposes (we don't want to moving when the kids are in school). Again, another reason to give it a go now.

My two cents! Good luck with it all.
 
if your child turns 3 in august you better start emailing all the schools you have your eye on now! applications for K1 were last year!
 
I came to HK 10 years ago and lived here for a year as a single university student. After returning to the States (where I'm from) I ended back in China a couple of years later and re-met my now-husband, a HK local. We married in HK, lived in Mainland China for awhile and have been back in HK for about 5 years. HK has been a big part of how my life has turned out so far so I wouldn't have not come here if I could do it all over again. We now have two small children--3 1/2 and 3 months-old.

Although HK has been good to us in many ways--my husband's family live here and we are able to earn a better living than we probably would if we were in the States, we plan to leave HK as soon as we are financially/practically able to. The pollution is getting really bad and we just feel like the quality of life our children will have here isn't what it could be elsewhere--we're not talking about money issues here--it's more like grassy public parks, blue skies all year round and stargazing anytime. We are dependent on public transportation which sometimes can be scary (I have a post here you can see about our village mini-bus problems). Also, maybe it's because we live a very local lifestyle, but we both just get fed up with how rude people can be here. Even my husband who spent his entire life in this city is pretty fed up.

For financial reasons we haven't been able to travel around Asia like some other posters on this site and we haven't been back to the States in over 3 years because whenever we get a chance to fly (usually in the summer) the airline tickets for our family are extremely expensive and we simply don't have the money to go. I often have the feeling that HK is a playground for rich people--in order to really enjoy the "finer things" you've got to have money. Where I'm from there is a lot of public space--like green parks that are free for use--but those types of places don't really exist in HK. That's my perception, though based on our particular circumstances. So, we do deal with the feeling of being "stuck" in this city. However, if you're being brought to HK through your husband's work and the company guarantees housing and travel then these might not even be issues for you at all.

But, the nice thing about HK is that you can come and go as you please. People move in and out of this city all the time--the population is always in flux so it just seems easier to come and try it for a time and if you find you want to go back then you just feel open to that option.

Good luck with your choice!
 
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