Pregnancy Loss Support Group

C

City Jammer

Registered User
Hi there, I did a little search on this forum and on different websites and found that there is no support group or any kind of resources available for pregnancy loss in HK. I lost my baby boy at 22 weeks and 2 days in mid-June and find this to be a most lonely sorrow. And I am no stranger to grief. I am trying to focus on my little girl who is past 20 months but I have a lot of questions about the medical system here (which I will be asking my gynecologist when I see her next week). I lost my baby due to subchorionic hemorrhage, which went undetected by two expensive private gynecologists and none at the Pamela Youde. Despite the fact that I was bleeding heavily, everyday, for three months. Even when I went to Queen Mary, nothing was done to stop the premature contractions (no injections, no pills, nothing) and I was left lying on the bed, tolerating the pain alone for almost 7 hours until my baby was born prematurely. Repeated requests to the nurses for at least a painkiller was pretty much ignored until a panadol was given to me five hours later. And his heart was still beating less than five minutes before he was born. I was not allowed to fly out of HK either to seek medical treatment in my home country.

Sorry for venting here but I am really curious to find out how women cope in situations like this, when their families are away from here and this seems to be a very taboo topic to talk about.
 
Hi Cityjammer, sorry to hear about your loss. I think talking about it helps, but the hard part is finding the right people to talk to. It sounds like you have quite a few feelings to work through surrounding your loss and the experience you had. What do you think would help you? To meet other mums who lost babies? or to talk with people that are willing to help you work through your feelings?
I had a difficult pregnancy and spent 10 weeks in Queen Mary so can empathise a bit about staff attitudes, they really don't want to know you if you are not at 24 weeks yet. It has taken me a long time to work through my feelings but I found it really helps to talk things through or even to write about it.
If you want to chat more let me know.
Again, I am deeply sorry for your loss.
 
Hi KathyKitzis, thank you for your reply. I was beginning to think that this topic is taboo on this forum too! I am sorry too for what you went through at QMH.

I have spoken to women who had gone through pregnancy loss and they shy away from the topic as quickly as they can. I really wonder how they managed! It's amazing how people would talk about loss of close family members but yet nobody wants to share about how they coped with miscarriage/pregnancy loss.

Advice given includes have another baby quick (one child can never replace another), go see a shrink (why would I want to pay money to someone who has never been in my shoes?), move on (where and how?) or most would pretend that nothing has happened. Questions asked to the hospital doctors were completely unanswered. They were probably afraid I might sue them, which would never give me back my baby anyway. I was prepared to move to a private hospital but the private gynecologists both said that only public hospitals are equipped to deal with emergencies and I was asked not to consider the option. I can honestly say that in the public hospitals, all they did was made me lie in bed and they did nothing at all. They didn't know why I was bleeding, doctors at Pamela Youde refused to refer me to QMH as they said I was not a high risk case, even though they have repeatedly told me that I would lose my baby anytime (they said that for three months). I went to QMH armed with a second detailed referral letter from Dr. Ngai along with my ultrasound pictures, highlighting the problem. They had wanted to turn me away when I first went there with the first referral letter. And still nothing was done.

I know I fought hard to keep this baby but I am not convinced that everything possible was done by doctors and medical staff I encountered to save us.
 
Hi Cityjammer, I am very sorry to hear about your loss and how the whole thing unfolded. I lost 3 pregnancies so I know the loss you are talking about. The miscarriages all happened before I hit 12 weeks so the circumstances surrounding the loss were different. They also happened quite a few years ago in when we lived in a different country so I can't really offer suggestions on the pregnancy counselling support here in HK. I did talk to an elderly woman who had suffered pre-term deaths at six or seven months so I can very well imagine the anguish you went through. How does one cope? I didn't go for counselling, I did get a lot of cliched advice (like you describe) from lots of well meaning people, and both my husband and I had different ways of grieving. The doctors could not find anything wrong with either of us, and we were told to "keep trying". We had just about given up when I found myself pregnant naturally in my early 40s. After an easy pregnancy, our daughter was born. Everytime the medical staff asked me if she was my first pregnancy, I had to keep saying, "she is my fourth, the first three ended in miscarriage". I still think of the lost babies, remembering how old they would have been if they had lived, but I guess I have learned to get on with life. It's hard to tell you that you have to work through your grief and there will be little things that trigger your recollection of the lost baby. Even if you have another baby, that there will be that missing baby in the middle. But the truth is that statistically one in 4 pregnancies end in miscarriage or pre-term death, so there are many mothers out there who are carrying their grief around with them.

The experience you have with the hospitals here sounds a lot like red tape and passing the buck that can happen. I haven't had direct bad experiences here with the public hospitals, although I can very well imagine. I am sorry I cannot give you suggestions on how to navigate (or battle) the hospital bureaucracy to find the answers you seek.
 
Hi CityJammer
I am so sorry to hear of the loss of your son.
I have contacted a friend and she is getting back to me with names of message boards you may like to try posting at. They are specifically for women who have suffered the tragedy of late term losses. I will post when I have the details of the sites.
 
Hi again,
To start, here is the URL for INCIID: Infertility, Pregnancy Loss and Adoption Bulletin Boards and Forums on INCIID

IF you scroll down to the bottom they have a "locked" (you have to apply for membership, so it is private viewing) forum for "Miscarriage and pregnancy loss support" they also have a "grief and loss" board as well, which is also private.

I don't know how active these boards are, I will hopefully be able to send you some more information soon.
xo
 
Hi Cityjammer,
I'm so sorry to hear about your lost. I can not even start to imagine the anguish and grief you must be going through right now. I had suffered a through a miscarriage between my two kids. Early term and nothing like you had experienced so the circumstances are very different. Immediately after having the miscarriage I become obsessed with getting pregnant again. Luckily I did get pregnant again 4 months after the miscarriage. However, not long after getting pregnant, I had an emotional breakdown. I became severely depressed. Anyways, I finally forced myself to go see a therapist and although I was very skeptical in the beginning (like you said, why would i want to pay someone who's never been through what I've been through to give me advice) it was honestly the best decision that I have ever made. With her help, I was able to mourn the lost of my child, pick myself back up and move on with life without feeling immensely guilty. Maybe worth a try when you are ready. Hang in there!
 
Hi Cityjammer.

I'm so sorry for your loss and that you have been unable to find a support group in HK.

I'm not sure what country you are originally from, but in Australia there is a a website called Essential Baby, similar to GeoBaby but with alot more forums. Scroll down the forum list to Miscarriage, Stillbirth & the Loss of a Child there are 2 forums in this section you could join, and they are very active.

Essential Baby

I hope you find the support you need.
Be kind to yourself
julie
 
Dear City Jammer,

Am really sorry for your loss. We are all here for you! :grouphug:

There was another member who had a similar experience and she donated books and literature to a number of hospitals in Hong Kong to help other parents.

Grief Support

We're here if you need to talk.
 
Thank you so much for all your replies :) Yesterday, I was having one of those I-just-can't-stop-crying days and I was touched to read your replies. Thank you for the websites and resources mentioned. I will take a look at them :)
 
Hi City Jammer
I can totally relate to your experience. I am so sorry that you too went through a devastating charade of medical incompetence. I have a different storey to yours but it involved me losing a twin back in March/April. I was seeing a leading HK obstetrician who misdiagnosed me to begin with then dismissed my calls for help when I was in pain that resulted in me collapsing, vomitting and crawling to the phone over a 40 minute period.

He told me to take a panadol. I was, at the time, bleeding internally (no evident blood, but extreme abdominal pain so much that rebound touching resulted in vomitting). I decided to go off to Queen Mary. Sadly I had an equally terrible experience there. The doctor was too scared to examine me and sent me home that night with antibiotics and bed rest. Needless to say, two days after that I had bled so much internally I am lucky to be here. Another 100ml of blood and it was irreversible. My daughter witnessed me collapsing and being resuscitated and taken by ambulance at home. I then needed emergency surgery and developed complications from the severe blood loss.

The hospital system, public and private, here is very average to say the least having experienced a taste of it over the course of 6 months! If I could fly home, I would but cannot fly until the baby is born. I have medical training and still could not convince these doctors to look at the possibility of a few scenario's. It was so frustrating.
I have several medio friends here also. They all tell me (as I do with people) get home if you can if there is a serious health problem. Let's hope I wont, but I'll take up that advice next time for sure.

Pm me if you ever need to vent!
 
Dear City Jammer

I posted before when you asked questions about subchorionic haematoma (as I had one at 9wks that dissipated by 16wks). I was very lucky and clearly you were not. My heart goes out to you for your loss, and I'm angry on your behalf at what you suffered in the hospital system here. No one should ever be treated so shabbily and uncaringly. I really think you might feel better to draft a strong letter of complaint and send it to the Hong Kong Medical Authority.

I don't know of any grief support here in Hong Kong, but like the others, I would suggest an online community. In some ways, online posting gives you more freedom to express yourself than face-to-face groups. I used to post on www.babycentre.co.uk and they have a very active forum for grief and loss during pregnancy. If you're American, you might prefer www.babycenter.com.

I really hope that you can find some peace sometime in the future. Keep crying - it's a healthy thing to do.

If you need to vent or just want to tell your story, pls keep posting here.

Very best regards and a big hug
Honkyblues
 
I am so sorry for your loss, its so heart breaking to read your post. I think for getting closure on this and some mental peace you need to get answers from people who were supposed to take care of you- The private doctor's, The Govt hospital staff. You need to take an appointment and talk to them as to why they left you alone at a time when they should have gone all out to help you. Questions like was this a difficult condition to diagnose and was this untreatable in your case? Most importantly ask them if they still have a beating heart inside of them? Otherwise I am afraid you will continue to feel cheated and betrayed by these people with whom you had put your trust.
Your loss is immense I cannot ever fathom how hard it must be for you to get to terms with this. Prayer will get you through this and the joy your little girl brings each day.
 
I had my appointment with Dr. Ngai today and I brought along a copy of all the tests that were done at QMH. She confirmed with the QMH doctors had so hastily told me. All my test results were normal and Dr. Ngai told me that they were very comprehensive indeed. No one knows why I had subchorionic hemorrhage in this pregnancy and it's unlikely that it will happen again, since I had a normal first pregnancy. She also told me that as a rule, private hospitals will not accept any women under 34 weeks of pregnancy if they go into preterm labour. She can't comment on the hospitals' management either and there are no pregnancy loss support groups in HK (I asked). I asked if my condition was so rare and difficult to diagnose that none of the other doctors could do it except for her. Dr. Ngai specializes in high risk obstetrics and she has seen other cases like mine throughout her years of practice, so it wasn't difficult for her to know right away what was wrong. She sympathized with me, that I had gone through a very difficult pregnancy and unfortunately, there are no answers to my questions.

I feel like I've just lost my baby all over again. I guess perhaps it's a good thing that I'm going back to work in 2.5 weeks' time.
 
Hi Cityjammer

I'm so sorry to hear about your loss, the awful treatment u went thru AND the brush off thereafter. Altho i've suffered a loss as well (mine was very early, hardly even 5weeks, so they call it a chemical) i cannot imagine what u've gone thru. I'm generally shocked and angry at the HK medical system, the way it's divided into "public vs private" and the silly notion of how they categorized (below 34wks, = public cases, complicated pregnancies = public, etc). To me, when a patient needs medical help and there's a doc available, who f***ing cares if it's public or private? Why shud there be a difference? This is jus not right! The doctors are all jus busy covering their own asses than caring for the welfare of the patients. I am also appalled to know the private hospitals do not have a set of medical teams on duty 24hours here. Awhile back, my mom needs some emergency treatment, and coming from Spore where hospitals and medical systems are top-notched and well equipped in ALL hospitals (public AND private) i was really in shock when we rushed her to a private hospital only to be told the only doc "on duty" there is a pediatrician! And when my DD was in high fever, the doc on duty was a orthopedic. How funny is that!

Anyway, sorry for ranting. I jus think the whole system is laughable and silly.

Sorry again for your loss...i just want to say i understand your frustration...

Perhaps seeing a shrink may not be all that bad, altho he/she may not have gone thru EXACTLY what u did, but they may able to help u to deal with your feelings and emotions? Just a tot. Take care of yourself.
 
Thank you Fennho, for your reply :)

I'm beginning to think that I should consider seeing a therapist afterall. I am reading all kinds of books on miscarriage and stillbirth (all ordered from Amazon).

If anyone has any recommendations, please send me a PM. Thanks again :)
 
Hello City Jammer,

Exactly one year ago I lost a baby at 24 weeks; it was the hardest thing I had ever gone through in my life so far. Thinking back I have a big gap of about four weeks where I did nothing but cry and sleep.

I still get sad a few times a week but not a few times a day like I did a year ago. Talking about it is what has helped me the most.

My husband and I did go to a therapist (in NY though) once a week for about six months...that was probably the best thing we did! It forced us to talk about it once a week with a neutral party. I felt most family and friends were uncomfortable talking about it with us or did not know what to say but, ?I am so sorry for your loss.? Once we were both back to work full time we thought about the loss less and less?however, we had not full dealt with the situation so the weekly therapist sessions became necessary to our healing process.

Every situation is different but at first the last thing I wanted to hear was about other people?s losses but it did help to make me not feel so alone!

It took us 7 months to get pregnant again and now that is my main focus but the pain/fear of the loss is still there and will always be there. I wish you luck while you go through this and do know there is a light at the end of the tunnel?but it is a very long tunnel in these situations!
 
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