My helper needs a helper? Advice please!

S

sea princess

Registered User
Hi Everyone

I am looking for some advice!

I have a new helper, been with us for 5 months, a direct hire from the Phillipines. Our previous helper was an older helper (late 50's), struggled communicating (not great English and poor hearing) and it often left us all frustrated and annoyed, especially our 5 year old who refused to spend time with her. Being older, she never left the apartment and I felt quite suffocated. When I found out I was pregnant with our second child, I knew we had to find someone capable of helping with a new born which lead us to employ our current helper.

Our current helper has impecable english, is innovative and fun with our 5 year old and for the first time ever, my husband and I can leave our daughter in safe, capable hands. She is very level headed and has good judgement.
She is gentle and caring with our 5 month old. We have a live out arrangement mostly (we have a room) but we also are happy to give her an allowance to live out so that we all have privacy. She lives a 5 minute walk away from our apartment which is really convenient. We pay her above award and a food allowance. She works 9am-6:30pm and leaves early on a Friday or Saturday when we are staying in.

Our apartment is 2,000 sqft with a garden and we have an old dog that requires a short walk once a day. Her duties are mainly cleaning, washing, ironing, occasional help with the children (mainly watching them so I can cook in the evenings). I am the cook as I like to do it and she isn't a cook! Also, car clean once a week or every second week.

So here goes the dilema! She took a very long lunch break last week of 1 hr 40 when I really needed a hand and when I told her to call next time if she was going to be a long time, she was taken back! Then two days later, she takes a two hour lunch break. My husband approached her and tells her he is disappointed in light of the fact that two days prior I had discussed with her to let us know if it's a long break. She was then very upset and said she is tired and cannot do so much work, it's too mmuch for her? Our previous helper before her complained she was bored with not enough work! She also has been moody and on the three occasions she has baby sat in the evenings in 5 months, she told our 5 year old the next day she was grumpy and tired becasue she had to stay up late to look after her and her sister. We were home by 11pm sadly! Not one for late nights with a small baby! Also, I had fed, bathed and out the kids to bed before we went.


So I am left with the issue of getting someone else in to help with the work load or try for helper number three. So I pose a few questions,

1. Is she using the situation Of being 'caught' out having long breaks as a means to get better working terms for herself, which are unrealistic
2. Are her requests reasonable?
3. It's easy to find cleaners in HK, but it's hard to find suitable people to care for your children, helpers that bond well with the children and which the children actaully like. Getting someone in to help with the car, garden, extra cleaning, is that fair?

When she is here, she is working pretty solidly, but I think she doesn't have much stamina and tires really easily.

Thanks, appreciate your thoughts on this one!
 
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Sounds like a helper who has gotten used to the easy and wonderful life in comparison to her counterparts and is unhappy to change the circumstance. She's probably been influenced negatively by other helpers (who may or may not have it easier).

I've interviewed heaps the last two weeks and found that many cope with your apartment size, two (if not three), pets and car without whinging about their lives. As far as I'm concerned, under no circumstance, is a helper who rarely gets asked to babysit on a rare date night (and only needs to turn up at 9 everyday) is allowed to talk to my child in that manner or grumble about it to me in anyway!

She needs to try working for a local family. She has no idea how cushy she has it (in comparison to most of her peers in a local family situation)! To be honest, not the sort of helper I'd even bother interviewing if she's fired (or looking for a job). Having said that though, if I could afford it, with your apartment size, pet, 2 kids, 2 FT working adults, I'd hire two helpers (live-in) and pay a normal wage.
 
i think she needs to be shown the door.

she already has a sweet deal and is milking you for more... bye bye, birdie, bye bye!

there is a helper out there who would LOVE to work the hours that she is, with the freedom that she has.
 
and yes, if money isn't an issue, i would fire this one and hire two in her place. give them each distinct tasks to be completed and to be responsible for...
 
helper

Quasimother
Thanks for the support. You know my instinct is that she is actually depressed. I guess she never thought she would find herself back here working as a helper again. But really, she should have thought about it all before she said 'yes.' I am a stay at home mum so it's not as though she's being left with the kids all day as well.
Carang
Thanks Carang. I spent the whole day today feeling guilt that she had to do heaps or ironing! Crazy, that's what she's paid for afterall!
 
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One other thing, I really dont want two helpers. The thought of more people in my house, aghh. I like my space. I am a stay at home mum and am very hands on with the kids. My youngest is breastfed so is attached to me most of the time anyway and our 5 year old is at school now during the day, so I really find it hard to believe our space is that big, it can't be done by one person. i am not after anything squeeky clean either. I am just happy not to have to do it!
 
man, listen, if you are a stay at home mum and you do most of the childcare and all of the cooking, you MUST find a new helper! she is taking you for a ride. you have nothing to feel guilty about. you are not her therapist. you are her employer. if this was ANY other job, her behaviour WOULD NOT be tolerated.... sack her tomorrow.

years ago, i worked for my mother's house-cleaning business. 3 of us would clean a house-top to bottom (2000-3000') in about 2 hours.... that's 6 hours total. so, there is no reason that she shouldn't be able to do it in 9 hours.
 
I hear what you are saying Carang. Like most people, she would rather the child care and not the cleaning, but that's not why I employed her and I have been very clear from the start her responsibilities. I suppose I am so disappointed and sad, especially for my older daughter who enjoys her company, limited as it is and for myself. She has admitted to me that she really would rather be just the 'nanny' (wouldn't all helpers?). That is her strength, not the domestic chores!

FYI, our previous helper cleaned our apartment in about 2-3 hours! So I agree, she should be able to do it easily.

Looks like I am going to have to find a new helper :(
(Big SIGH!)
 
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I agree with everyone here. She has it good compared to 90% of helpers in Hong Kong. You seem like extremely fair employers who give her a reasonable workload, decent pay and a degree of freedom.
She's just testing the boundaries to see how far she can go.
Doing the housework / childcare for a normal family should not be draining if that's your only task full-time.
It's not a matter of what she "likes" to do. I sometimes do tasks at work I don't like, but I signed up for my job and get paid a salary for it.
It's a shame, too, since she gets along with your kids.
Have you tried talking to her about how serious the situation is? That she could lose her job?
 
Hi Gracey
we have talked about it and she has been very honest in telling me her capabilities which has made it hard and why I posted I suppose? She has told me she cannot do the job as it is and she understands if I need to find a new helper or if we decide to take on extra help, she said she does not expect the same salary obviously. So I think she's being pretty resonable and I like to think it's genuine. I suppose that's my dilema? She also acknowledges it's a good job, pay, conditions and she doesnt have to cook (she hates cooking) and knows she would be hard to employ. Aghh, the dilema!
 
Hi Sea princess

I think it depends on what you re really looking for. I m in a similar situation. My helper is brilliant for some things:perfect english, really imaginative with my 4 years old for play, she taught him a LOT. She s very smart, loves to read(she borrows a lot of my books) for xmas she wanted a subscription to National geographic magazine !!!
She is the PERFECT nanny

But she doesn t cook at all, and she does expect a long lunch break(2h)
She starts at 8 am finishes at 7pm, and her salary is very good ($7000 a month)
We have 10 months old twins as well so days are long for everybody.

For me the choice was who do I want to look after my kids??? Do I want someone who doesn't care being treated like almost a slave ( I m generalizing) or someone who is smart who I can trust.
Yes people might think that she s "using" us but we don t feel that way. she has the same expectations that I would have in a job why is that so bad???
 
Hi Seaprincess

There's no such thing as the perfect employee, nor the perfect employer for that matter. No one in any job situation gets to choose what they like to do, or are good at. However the whining and sulking by your maid is not acceptable behaviour, I would never tolerate it. It's a hassle to find another maid but I would do so before the rot sets in. THere are certainly some good maids out there. Good luck searching.
 
Seems you have two issues here: (1) helper wants to do childcare and not cleaning, which is what you primarily hired her for; and (2) helper blatantly disregards your schedule/requests.

As a SAHM, I'd have a pretty hard time dealing with #1 but might be able to get comfortable with it if I thought she was truly wonderful with the kids. Even 2,000 sq/ft isn't really that much space to clean and probably doesn't need to be cleaned nearly as thoroughly or as often as most helpers are asked to clean. However, there is no way I could live with #2. She blew you off two days after you made a simple request that she treat you as her boss rather than someone she is doing a favor for?! How could she even be a caretaker for the kids when she takes off without telling you during the day? Sounds to me like she actually isn't all that committed to childcare either. I would already be looking for her replacement. Having to start from scratch with a new helper (and having to find one again) is a total bummer and I'm sorry you have to do so, but it probably will be best in the long run.

Also as a SAHM, I would suggest that you make sure any helper sees you as the boss and not your husband. Everyone runs their family differently, but if it were me, I would have talked to her and not had your husband be the one to do it. The helper should, of course, listen to and take direction from your husband if he gives it, but if you are at home all day, you run the house and she should respect you as the boss. You can also be the employer for immigration purposes even if you are here on a dependent visa (as I am), they just want proof of household income not your personal income.
 
Hi penelope
Thanks for your perspective. It sounds very similiar to ours. Yes, I value the child care/nannying very highly even if it is infrequent. My helper is similiar, a reader, very smart. We have similiar university backgrounds. She is different from other helpers and I suppose that was the attraction for me. She was always going to struggle with the house chores, I knew that. I have seen her become more and more tired from it and I want to be a reasonable human being without being a door mat. it's hard to strike the balance. I think she pushed the boundaries as she rally wanted to be caught. She didn't know how to bring up with me the fact she wasn't managing the role. I am a new mum and like most women, have a travelliung husband.
SAM and zyxwz and lisa88
I agreee with you that the issue really is the whining about it and ignoring my request. I think I tiptoed around the issue when I told her and you need to be very balck and white with helpers. I have learnt a big lesson there. I have sat down and had a conversation with her regarding this. She has apologised and has acknowledged she was wrong.
I appreciate everyone's advice and support. I'm not sure what I plan to do now. I am still thinking about my various options and will do the math on havng someone come in for a few hours here and there and reduce her salary accordingly. We can see if it works, if it doesn't, I'll need a new helper.
 
Sea Princess, you do realise why she's willing to take a pay cut, less duties etc. instead of being fired right? My current helper (whom I have just told that it's no longer working out - with very good reason (long story, not for here) is like yours. I've tried to terminate her before but she begged not to be terminated despite making MAJOR mistakes concerning house and kids that would have given any parent a heart attack and I kept her going. I found out that if a helper is terminated, while she can find another job especially if she needs to, has to pay at least HKD20000 for re-employment.

But, in our case, we have decided after lots and lots of patience, when she made another MAJOR mistake which put our baby's safety at risk, we've decided to cut all ties. I've been interviewing a lot of helpers and there are LOTS who will be willing to live out (and do a lot more) for their basic salary as long as they are paid for boarding and given their food allowance and transport. We're down to 2 whom we liked (came with references too). I'll be deciding tomorrow so I'll pass you the contact details of the one we didn't chose. Both are willing to do the job for basic wage + boarding + food allowance + transport allowance and work any hour you request.
 
penelope, while it's fine and good that you pay a very high salary and you get excellent child care for it (good for you!) that is NOT what this helper was hired to do. she was hired to clean the house with occasional childcare responsibilities.

i don't know about where you come from, but if i had a job and i took a 2 hour lunch without prior consent from my boss two days after being given a warning for exactly the same thing...i have a feeling that i wouldn't last long in the position. just because she lives in your house doesn't change the "rules of engagement".... if what she has done would not be accepted in any other workplace, why accept it in your home, the place that is supposed to be your refuge, your sanctuary?
 
Hi Sea Princess --
You say she's been honest in telling you her "capabilities" but it's not about capability. Every able-bodied person is capable of doing housework. Anyone with a will can learn basic cooking, even if they aren't a great cook. It's not that she is incapable -- she's unwilling.
She CAN do it. She won't, and that's different.
Sorry if I'm sounding hard here, but none of us can pick or choose our duties.
When I started working after graduation, I did all sorts of boring things "below" my level of education, like data entry, answering phones and being a "gopher" getting coffee and Xeroxing documents. On the side, I did babysitting and other menial tasks. Hell, more than a decade later and gainfully employed, I still sometimes make the coffee and the copies when the secretary's out!
I'm not very sympathetic to this helper because, until now, my husband and I never had a FT amah. We're both professionals, but we're not above doing the dishes or laundry. And you said yourself that you do the cooking. It's amazing that a domestic helper would feel she is above doing things we do all the time.
Your helper is not being reasonable. She sees a soft employer and is taking advantage by pulling your heart strings, since she doesn't want to be out of a job or have to deal with agents / immigration to get back into Hong Kong.
There is a larger problem that the Philippines is so d**n poor that even university graduates have to take menial jobs overseas -- but that's a broad societal problem, not your personal problem.
I'm with Carang. If I took 2-hour lunches, disappeared without notice, and then complained about tasks that were clearly set out to me, I'd be sacked!
 
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Just curious -- how old is this helper?
We're just beginning to interview for our 1st helper now, hopefully to get someone in before I give birth in late Aug / early Sept.
One of the candidates is quite young and would be a new hire direct from the Philippines. Those are the down sides. She also has some up-sides.
But I'm worried that someone young and new here would be quickly disillusioned to the type of work expected.
 
Gracey and Quasimother

Quasimother
I hear what you are saying, I have done some very ordinary jobs to help fund my university studies! And I was just happy to do the job, it was a means to an end and I knew the money was crucial to me.
Gracey
Our helper is 41, single and has no children.

spoke with her references who all spoke so highly of her. Admitedly, they used her more for child care and less for domestic chores. It goes to show, what suits one family, may not suit the next.
 
I tend to agree with carang's comments.

I'd also be a bit worried about her real intentions. She knew what she was being employed to do, yet won't do it properly. She blatantly disregarded your comments about her lunch break. Will she listen and follow proper instruction if you have specific requirements with your children? As much as she might be good at the babysitting, given she complained in front of your child, what happens if she slacks off there too? Does she enjoy babysitting the kids or does she enjoy the freedom of not having you in the house?
No one loves cleaning, but if she genuinely wants this job I don't think the conditions you have given her to work in are unreasonable.
At the end of the day the fact she didn't listen to you would ring warning bells for me.
Good luck whatever decision you make.
 
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