Is internation kindergarten really necessary?

M

maxmom0901

Registered User
Hi,
We are moving to HK in Jan and are looking for school for my almost 4 years old son (4 in February). I am tempted to put him in local Kindergarnten and international primary school later. Will that be a problem to get into HKIS or ESF primary school if he only goes to local kindergarten now? He can only speak English now. Thanks
 
What is your goal? Is it to have your little one learn a new language or is it to avoid the high fees charged by IKs?
Will you be in Hong Kong for a short period of time or are you looking to stay a good while (4+ years)
There are plenty of children that go from local K's into international schools - its much harder to go in the opposite direction.

There are a number of parents on this board who have taken the local route (we chose local private schools) who are very happy with their choices.

Please let us know what you are trying to accomplish for your child and we can suggest possible paths to get there.
 
both of my kids went to a local kindergarten (we have also now chosen a local primary school for our son, who is enjoying it quite a lot ...but there is a lot of homework).

at the kindergarten, there are lots of western kids, indian kids, filipino kids, black (not sure if they are from uk, usa or africa)
 
Thanks for the reassurance. We are moving from US and I am Chinese. I would like my son to learn some Cantonese. My husband is American and he thinks it is ok to put our son in local school to learn some Chinese and he is not worry about his English at all. My family on the other hand think my son should keep up with the English. We are not sure how long will we stay due to the high cost in education. It is really amazing to see how many international school around and how much they cost and still have a long waiting list. I am only afraid my son couldn't get used to it since he only speaks English right now. With the change that he is going to face maybe international school will make him feel more at ease?
 
I have 3 children; myself and my wife are both western and do not speak any Chinese at all.

We decided to put our kids thru Cantonese kindergarten and Mandarin primary school. All 3 are now trilingual. Our kids are not gifted but just normal regular kids. If they can do it, there is no reason why any child could not do the same.

Education in Hong Kong ranges from free to extremely expensive - the choice is yours.

If your son is a normal (no learning difficulties) child, there is absolutely no reason why he could not get used to Chinese based education, if thats what you want for him.

I have a number of friends who look Chinese but cannot speak/read/write any of the language. I feel sad and sorry for them as they struggle far more than I do with my western look as people expect them to know the language.
The same thing for your son, think of how he will feel growing up and not being able to speak Chinese at all. You can give him the chance and educate him with the best of all worlds with multi-lingual education which is much easier to do here than back in USA.
 
howardcoombs, did you find local schools to be exceeding rigorous/rigid/competitive? this is our main concerns with sending our daughter to a local primary. not sure if you know the answer to this, but would international schools such as gsis/fis/hkis be able to teach her adequate mandarin?
 
"local schools" can mean many different things and many different flavours. You will need to be more specific.

There are some schools which are relaxed and there are some that are intense. Its the same with International schools as well. There is a world of difference between GSIS vs Kellett or SIS vs CDNIS in terms of academics and competitiveness.
We sent our kids to Lingnan kindergarten to learn Cantonese. A loving and relaxed environment. Even with that, there was a lot of homework because you cannot get away from learning characters and characters require repetition.

For primary we sent them to KCS - a very competitive and rigid environment with Mandarin immersion. It was hard but they adapted and got thru it. There is no reason why any normal kid could not do the same.

As for "adequate", it depends on how you define it. Our goal was to have our kids fluent (read, write, speak) with natural and proper accent. We have achieved that and no, I dont believe that is possible at GSIS, FIS, HKIS. If you choose those schools, you will need a lot of extra tuition to get to the level we wanted for our kids.
 
I am very impressed. Do you hire tutor for your kids to learn Chinese? And how do you keep up with the level of English they should have? Thanks again for all the input.
 
you use english at home, right? so long as you read with your kids and continue to converse with them in english, their standard of english won't diminish (at least my kids' english hasn't diminished).

we do not have a tutor for our kids as the primary school offers an afterschool homework programme so that our son can do his homework at school under the supervision of his teachers. he still comes home with homework, but he does the 'hard stuff' at school.

however, if my husband didn't read/write chinese, then we would most likely have to employ a tutor to help our son prepare for his exams.
 
maxmom0901 said:
I am very impressed. Do you hire tutor for your kids to learn Chinese? And how do you keep up with the level of English they should have? Thanks again for all the input.
Click to expand...

No need to be impressed, its not that unusual nor a great achievement.

Chinese families in Hong Kong as well as in China master multi-lingual all the time; ditto for the subcontinent. Most European countries do dual and many do tri and quadlingual instruction (eg: Holland & Austria)
But for some strange reason, English speaking countries(and their citizens) generally have this reluctance about multiple languages. Kids are sponges, they will adapt and learn everything you throw at them.

Yes, we've had a tutor in the house monday to friday since the kids were 2.5 years old. If they were going to English schools, the parents would naturally help with their basic questions. As the parents lack Chinese, it is essential to have someone take up the slack.

The level of English is just fine as the parents language in the house is English. Certainly they are not as far advanced as their counterparts in English only schools but thats fine, they have plenty of time to catch up when they get to higher grades and do more English.
 
The bigger problem is not language they know or don't know, but the simple math of international school admissions.

If you are applying for the international schools, generally most of them start at age 4 (4 years old by September of the year they start). There will be say 100 positions and 400 applicants.

If you are applying for an international schools at age 5, you'll be in a situation where there will be 20 positions and 400 applicants.

If you are applying for an international school at age 6, you'll be in a situation where there will be 10 positions and 400 applicants.

Ok, these numbers are not spot-on accurate but used to illustrate the point that getting into the international schools is incredibly difficult, more so when the kids get older. You may have read that the competition for international school places is unbelievable, with some families relocating to Singapore or even 'splitting up' sending one parent back 'home' while the other is in Hong Kong awaiting an opening at a school. It's considered a major problem with hiring executives for Hong Kong right now and there is not much hope on it improving in the near future (unless the economy collapses).

Now if you want to go into the local stream and stay there, then this is irrelevant. But you posted that you were willing to spend a few years in the local system and then just switch over to an international primary when they were a bit older. I just want you to be aware that might not be as easy as you hope.

There are several international schools where they can be fully immersed in Chinese language, such as the ISF Academy or Chinese International. Singapore International and Canadian International and other internationals also have Chinese programs as well. You might want to consider those as an options.
 
penguinsix said:
If you are applying for the international schools, generally most of them start at age 4 (4 years old by September of the year they start). There will be say 100 positions and 400 applicants.

If you are applying for an international schools at age 5, you'll be in a situation where there will be 20 positions and 400 applicants.

If you are applying for an international school at age 6, you'll be in a situation where there will be 10 positions and 400 applicants.

Ok, these numbers are not spot-on accurate but used to illustrate the point that getting into the international schools is incredibly difficult, more so when the kids get older.
Click to expand...

While I agree with the rest of your post penguinsix, I completely disagree with the picture you are painting above. My experience has been very different when talking about later years. Most people dont like to switch - they get into a school and stay there. The only movements are people leaving and new people coming in - for most schools this is about even or a slight demand (not 10 vs 400 you are painting).

This I know for a fact : Right now (to start immediately) if you wish to apply for a position at ISF or HKIS or SIS for all years above 6, there are positions open (this was accurate as of 3 weeks ago). I'm fairly confident that most international schools will be similar with a few positions available.
 
on the other hand, it seems that it is most difficult to find spaces for P1 admission. that if you were looking for P4 admissions you may have more of a shot with international schools than you would if you were looking for P1.

at least that's how it used to be.

also, there are other, not top-tier international schools that you could consider (all of which have an english stream):

korean international school
japanese int'l
hong lok yuen int'l
delia school of canada
lantau int'l
norwegian int'l

but they don't necessarily have fantastic chinese programmes.
 
You're right that people don't like to switch, but there are still so many people coming in it can be quite difficult even at later years to get a place. Some schools' Year/Grade 1 and 2 are still well oversubscribed. It would be interesting to see what the actual numbers are. We were told for Year 1 at the Canadian school it was a wait list of 80 with about 10 openings for example.

By the way, are you talking about above Grade (Year) 6 or above age 6 for the schools you listed?

Tangentially, I wonder if the difficulty in primary is due to the fact many expats in the finance world come to Hong Kong at 'that point' in their life when they have younger kids, whereas when they have older kids and more established they aren't necessarily in line for an overseas transfer. Not sure if that is the case--just sort of seems that way.
 
it's not always the case, but i DO think it has something to do with the parents being at "that time in their life" when it's easier to take up employment overseas. i know many parents would think twice with slightly older kids, especially as they get closer to secondary school. so fewer people are newbies arriving with older kids, but on the flip side, those who are already here and have their kids in secondary school may be reluctant to leave for the same reasons.
 
There are long waiting lists at every ESF/International school, and yes, places are in more demand at Reception/P1.

Two things to keep in mind -
1. When you hear that school X has 400 children on the waiting list, odds are that each of those children is on a dozen other waiting lists around town. So once a child gets a place, it frees up a waiting list place at several other schools.
2. Senior secondary (from Grades 9/Year 10 up) also tend to have places available - in my experience, many international (and local) schools lose at least a double digit percentage of these students every year - mostly because the parents want them to study a different curriculum or in a different country, or even so they get Home Status for university fees.
 
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