Get live-in or live-out helper?

S

SarahHK

Registered User
Hello moms-

We may be moving to HK from US this fall and I was wondering what the pros/cons/suggestions are for hiring helper - particularly the advantages and disadvantages of a helper living in in such tight quarters or living out issues.

Some background: we have an active 2yo boy, my husband will work long hours, I will occasionally work from home (writing), and we view home as a haven. We generally value privacy but are open to change.

PS - do helpers really live in those tiny rooms? There are so many cultural details to adapt and learn re: helpers in HK.

Thanks in advance for your advice.
 
yes, they really live in those tiny rooms. but that's not to say that you couldn't rent a 3 bedroom and give her a proper bedroom (we did this before).

a live-out foreign domestic helper is illegal. if caught, you will likely be banned from hiring a helper again, could be fined and even jailed for breaching conditions of stay for the helper. the helper, if caught, could be fined, jailed and deported.

many people choose to take the risk, but personally, it's not a risk i would take.
(same holds true for part-time foreign domestic helpers)

it is possible to hire a local person to cook/clean for you, but (1) costs more (2) communicating can be difficult as they often speak little to no english.
 
I'm sure most will disagree with me, but in my very limited experience with having a (live out) helper, I have to say I really don't like it. Yes, it's fabulous to have someone doing the cooking, cleaning, my home looks great, help with laundry, ironing I would never do(just hubs biz shirts), etc. And for the 2 months following the second birth and c-section, it was awesome as I was weak. But now I'm back to nearly full strength(did anyone else not sleep last night?), and the relationship has soured a bit (almighty dollar reasons), and well, I just can't wait till she stops working for us. Having someone around all the time, LISTENING to your private conversations, observing your family habits and relationships, and even giving the odd comment or judgement(!), is just too much for me.
This helper talk seems to be a never-ending can of worms here in hk, and I am glad to leave it behind.
I support live out, even if it's not legal. Tins of people do it, locals and expats alike.
If I were in the position where I had to hire F?t live in, I would get a 'fresh grad' from the Philippines, and train her according to how I would want our family to operate. No superiority complex, no attitude. Ach, I won't go on. My 2 cents:)
 
Sarah -- Just to explain some background.

Foreign domestic helpers (FDH) -- mostly Filipinas if you want an English speaker -- have to be hired on a full-time contract. That means that you are responsible for their room, board, health insurance, etc., as well as a salary that is a little under HK $4,000 (US $500) a month.

Some people, like myself, will hire a Filipina "amah" (as we call them here) and then pay extra for her to live outside the home. As Carang said above, this is technically not allowed in the contract, but many people do it anyway. I know dozens of families -- both local and expat -- who do this. There's another thread around here that goes into those pros and cons. In a decade here, I've never heard of anyone being caught or punished for it. I think Immigration only gets involved if there is a case of abuse. But, again, there is a small risk.

Technically, FDH also cannot do outside part-time work, but most of them do. In my office of 20-30 expats, I think all of them use a part-time Filipina helper, who is usually paid HK 60-65 an hour (US $7.50- $8).

My husband works long hours and I work 3 days in an office, 2 days at home, where I need quiet and privacy. (I think we might do similar work). We are expecting our first child in a few months, and expecting our first "amah" in a few weeks. Like I said, we will pay extra for her to have her own accommodation. We also don't want her to squeeze into a tiny "helper's room" and be around us 24-hours.

We chose to have a full-time because of the impending birth, and because I will be returning to work several months after the baby is born. Our amah will mostly work as a nanny.

But before this, we were perfectly happy with a part-time lady who came once a week just to do the heavy lifting, like the floors and bathrooms. Otherwise, we did all our own groceries, cooking, laundry, etc., and were just fine.

Carang's reference to a "local person" means a Chinese person, usually a woman from a poor province of Mainland China. I've had some limited experience with local cleaners, and they were not good. They are more expensive than the Filipinas and, in my opinion, less careful, too chatty and can be a bit unprofessional. This is not meant to be a racist statement, as I'm Chinese myself. But there is a cultural difference. Also, the "local" or Chinese helpers will probably not speak English. This is not an issue for me, but it might be for you.
 
If you can stay at home most of the time, and as your child is no longer a baby, why not start with part-time help and see how you like it? You can always get a full-time later if you want. Also note that getting a full-time from the Philippines usually takes 2-3 months.
 
We have a toddler and two dogs. We also feel that our home is our haven and value our privacy more than a very tidy home. Therefore, we decided not to hire a full time, live in domestic helper. For several reasons, a live out domestic helper is not an option (one major reason being that I think it would still feel like having someone in our home for the majority of the day would be uncomfortable for us). We have hired a part-time, local woman to come in and do some of the major cleaning three times per week and have grown to trust her enough to leave our toddler with her for one evening a week.

We have made some sacrifices: my husband has to do some grocery shopping and cooking after work, which luckily he doesn't mind; we have missed out on many social events, both during the day and in the evenings; we didnt have a night out alone until our child was two; there is a language barrier with our current cleaner - she only speaks Cantonese - however, we did have someone prior to that who could speak English as well; I do some work from home and have had to work around nap and bedtime schedules; and finally I don't get much of a break during the week.

All this said, I don't think I would trade it for a full time, live in helper, as the major advantage to us, privacy, is too important.
 
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I have to say that I find our live-in helper INVALUABLE. We got a 3 bedroom so that she could have a real bedroom and some privacy when needed. My husband and I were weary at first about it, but now find it soooo very helpful especially as I have a 17month old and now a 2month old. It's been really helpful with the breastfeeding as feeding on demand is just that...on their own schedule so you never know when you have to feed especially the first couple months and my older one is now very active and needing time outside. It just has given us the freedom to spend time with both babies and she cooks and cleans for us. I still do most of the shopping with the baby while she watches the older one. Yeah, we can't run around the house naked anymore lol, but it's a small sacrifice for us. It's also been great since the both my daughter and baby usually goes to bed around 7 for at least 4 hours, me and my husband can have some time to ourselves and even go out for dinner nearby.
 
Welcome to HK !
It took us more than 2 years, and a second child, to take a decision about a helper. It is a really different cultural understanding, but you have to live here, to see how it works, to make it clear. Some people never hired a helper, but most of expatriates do, for a good reason. These helpers replace our families/friends/baby sitters/cleaning ladies... who ever you need to be there when you have a dentist appointment, a diner out, something urgent to do, or just have some time for yourselves.
Finding someone who fits your family takes some time, a helper is not part of your family, but spends more time with you than anybody else.
We are sooooo happy we found someone who fits our family, who likes to play with our kids, and that we can trust. She is not doing everything, as I'm the one to take care of my kids, or to cook, or do the grocery shopping, but she is making my life so much easier.
Spend some time in HK, see how it works, and give it a try.
 
Thanks for all this helpful info! I had no idea about the legal issues, local help, etc so will start getting to know the system. Please keep the comments coming if you have anything to add!
 
Hi SarahHK,

I have had a helper for 2.5 years. Live in. At first my husband and I both worked full time, we had several dogs and it was great to come home to a clean house every day and know that the dogs were well walked and well looked after. Initially I was really against a live-in for just us (we had previously always had just a part-time cleaner) but my husband insisted we had one if I wanted dogs because we traveled a lot and worked very long hours. Anyway, despite my initial reluctance it was actually great to have that indulgence.

Since I have had my baby, though, I have stopped working and I have to say I do feel differently. Sometimes I wish I had the house to myself, I'm tired of someone always being around and I'm tired of having little real privacy. On top of that we have problems with her performance, and her attitude and it seems like all my husband and I talk about at the moment is our helper!

It really is great to have someone living in so they are there whenever you need someone to look after your baby, but it does come at a price. Well, it does for me, but many people love it.

If I could choose, I would have somebody part time or live out but unfortunately I am stuck in my situation for the next 7 months as my helper is pregnant (another potential, albeit rare pitfall). She had only been working for us for 5 months before this happened. It is illegal to terminate your helpers contract if she is pregnant, I have offered for her to fly back home at 5 or 6 months pregnancy and still pay her entire pregnancy salary and maternity leave but she won't because she wants to have the baby here in HK. The worst thing is that I start a very intensive university course in September and my academic year falls right across her third trimester and maternity leave, so it really is a bit of a disaster for me.

Anyway, maybe start with a part-time as someone else suggested and see how you get on...having said that, if you find someone who is a great fit with your family then live-in can work very well. Unfortunately I haven't found that person yet.

Good luck, and I hope you love Hong Kong.
 
live in vs live out

Hi
I think you have been given great advice from everyone here. When we first moved here with a three year old and an old dog, we plunged straight into a employing a full time helper as we wanted the opportunity to travel and with an old dog, needed the reassurance she was being cared for when we were away. Our first helper came highly recommneded from another expat family who were relocating back to Canada. She interved well and was a mature lady. We thought she would be a great replacement for our daughters grandparents who minded her back in Australia. However, she was like the flat mate that never left the apartment and it was hell! She never went out, even when given a day off or an afternoon off. She would rather just sit around the house and I felt as though I had no privacy or space. She was also not great at minding our daughter, had average english and as a consequence we rarely left our little one with the helper in 2 years. She was a big mistake!

We then employed another helper and opted for live out. She was younger, better educated and has amazing english skills. she was a teacher in the Philippines and can engage with our children very well. Live out works well for us as a family. When I want my space I can tell her not to come in or go home early which she likes too. It gives me more flexibility and privacy. She also lives in close proximity to our apartment so if I need her, it will take 5 minutes for her to arrive. When my husband travels, she sometimes stays with us if I ask her to.

There are pros and cons for both options. I cant on the spare of the moment at night go for a walk and leave the kids or jump in the car and meet my husband, but if I'm organised and planned I can have great flexibility.

One other consideration is your apartment space. One of our issues is that our apartment is very open plan. This is not so good if you have a helper. So bear this in mind when chosing and apartment to live in. It's handy to have a kitchen area which is closed off from your lounge/living space.

Good luck.
 
whereas our live-in helper left the house on her day off at 7am and usually returned around 9:30-10pm. so she wasn't underfoot at all.

after having gone without a helper for the past 6 months, i can honestly say that our quality of life has deteriorated. i work 6 days/week, hubby works, too. we've had to put the kids into full-day school, simply because we couldn't arrange to have someone pick them up everyday at lunch. i find cooking difficult as i don't get home from work and picking up the kids until after 6-6:30pm and as my kids usually go to bed 7:30-8pm, it leaves me a small window to make dinner, serve it, help with homework, help shower kids and get them into bed. i've resorted to frozen pizzas, ceasar salad, sandwiches and mac & cheese for most of our meals when i don't buy take-away. by the time the kids are in bed, i'm exhausted. hubby and i haven't had a chance to do anything by ourselves in 6 months.

the only thing i'm enjoying? the extra money in our pocket.

that said, we are seriously thinking about getting another helper....soon.
 
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