Frozen v. Fresh food

leah... this is what kind of irked me...

"For me, there is such a difference btwn fresh and frozen foods that I couldn't imagine buying frozen for my wee one."

to me that implies that those of us that feed previously frozen food (never mind non-organic) are deliberately doing something that isn't good for our children.

my comments about 360 etc were simply that i don't know how someone could feed a family of 4-5 on less than $20,000/month. admittedly, i've only been once and have not much intention of going back again after what i saw the first time. it is WAYYYYY out of my budget. HOWEVER, if you have a larger budget for food, then by all means go for it. personally, we don't have that kind of money to be spending on what i consider "fancy" foodstuffs. ( i seem to remember $40 for a loaf of bread, or something ridiculous... but this was when it first openned and it may have changed a little since then.)

what it all boils down to is priorities, and it doesn't make one of us a better or worse parent than the other.

as i said in a previous post, we each do the best we can by our children and THAT is what we have to remember.
 
ps> i'm sure there are plenty of people in hk that spend $20,000/month on food, just not us... it wasn't a put down on you, it was a comment on my own situation.

sorry if i caused offence, none was intended.
 
LeahH said:
Additionally, you can ususally get veg/fruit/meat and fish at 360 at significantly marked down rates (40-70% off).
Click to expand...

Just curious, how do we do that? Are the items marked down at evening time (thus no longer "same day fresh" but really still usable)? I know some fruit/veggies are marked down when they are looking a bit over-ripe, but do they do that for meat and fish as well? I would love to save some money at 360, and would appreciate the advice. :)

Thanks. :)
 
MBLW, 8 months pregnant with my third (in 3 years) I doubt I'll be making a trip out to see who farms in a way that might make me change my mind about any sorting of farming in HK! Of course their practices will undoubtedly be better than those used on the mainland but that doesn't, for me anyway, cancel out the fact that soil used to grow comes from one of the most polluted countries in the world.

Whilst some people complain about the use of fertilizers in places like Australia and NZ, I am satisfied with the produce I get from both those countries. Unless you completely shun all chemicals (deodorant, cleaning chemicals, hairspray, etc), live in a pollution free environment (which clearly none of us do) I don't think it's worth worrying about the tiny amounts of insecticides left after washing your fruit and veg.

As for the costs of places like Olivers and 360 - they are really scary. Our food spend per month is awful enough without setting foot in those places. I remember the first time I went to 360 and saw that a whole chicken was $400! I almost fainted.

At the end of the day, whatever our convictions we're just trying to do what we think is right for our families.
 
Aussiegal, good luck with your pregnancy. I still think you should visit out here before you make a judgment about what you haven't seen yet but if you are completely satisfied with the way things are as far as your food supply goes, then that is wonderful.

My take--if the chemicals kill insects I don't want to be eating them--in the same way I don't want to spray a room with Baygone and then inhale it. No, we will never live in a pollution-free environment, no matter where we live on earth--but that won't stop me from doing what I can to minimize my exposure--including simple things like taking my shoes off before I come inside as to not track icky things in on them, cleaning with vinegar and baking soda as much as possible, using vegetable products for my hair and skin needs and trying to find affordable ways to minimize my exposure to pollutants in my food. I think my health is worth it and so is that of my children and there is scientific evidence pointing to the potential devastating effects of the amount of chemicals and pollutants that each of us is exposed to--one area that these effects especially shows up in is fertility and the development of unborn babies--the most sensitive areas of our humanity, apparently:

A Flood of Gender Bending Chemicals
 
Jaetree - at 360 they mark down from around 2-4pm (after the lunch time shoppers are done), sometimes earlier on the weekend.

The fruit is usually fine for ages, the veg good for a few days (except things like leaf which tends to go off quickly). The meat and fish I would typically freeze asap (if it's chilled) or batch cook that day and then freeze (if it's previously frozen).

The prices are becme comparable, if not less, than regular supermarkets and online suppliers with overseas organic produce (won't be cheaper than locally grown though most likely).

There is also a section behind the long life milk, near the dairy, that has marked down dry goods - everthing from fairtrade coffee to crisps.

Also, they generally have 2 for 1 specials in the health food/medicine section that's good for supplements. They are the only place in HK that I've found that does montmerency cherry juice concentrate (excellent for us pregnant ladies that can't get to sleep at night!). But if anyone else has found this, I'd be very interested - it's the only way I can get to sleep now!
 
Hey There,

Hope ya'll had a fab CNY. I haven't made it over to the farmer I buy my veggies from yet, but here is another farmer out here (from the photos, I know where his farm is at). He delivers. $200 HKD/year membership, $150 HKD/week for 3 kg of fresh, organic veggies delivered. That's something to check out. But, I'll get more info...still trying to find the phone number for another guy too.

Happy Eating!

The Organic Garden and Veggie Van
 
This is also interesting. Two weekends ago, my husband and I went for an evening walk on a path that kind of meandered off in a direction we had never walked out here before and I think we walked by this lady's garden because I remember my husband remarking, "Wow! Look at all these flowers!" It's quite scenic out here! Anyway, I think it's neat that she can hire some people with disabilities--growing things is hard work but it is so rewarding and also very therapeutic! I'm going to give her a call!

http://www.flowerworldhk.com/contact_us_e.php
 
The English on this isn't fabulous but it does describe what you can do at the organic gardens out here--they are very transparent--and offer tours and education programs--loads of schools come out here for field trips to learn about plants, organic farming and to pick their own fruits and veggies. It's a really great idea for a weekend trip. I like that part of what the farmers do out here is educate people--they are passionate about what they do and want others to join in with it.

Pat Heung Organic Farms Complex
 
Okay, I went over to the local farmer I buy veggies from today and bought a lot of really beautiful spinach (straight out of the ground again) as well as some lettuce and tomatoes. Wished I could have bought cucumbers but they come into season in March-April.

The people I buy from have been living on the plot of ground where they are at for 30 years. It's a mom, dad and son operation. Their last name is Chen. Their phone number is 2443-0900. However, since they are very local, local people, you're going to have to speak Cantonese or Mandarin with them.

Here's an areal view of where it's at (look closely, you can see our house...:haha:)

Kam Tin Country Club

I think the emerging "problem" I see here is that these people know gardening but they aren't exactly into marketing themselves. The above post I made about the Veggie Van guy shows that he has figured out how to market to foreigners--whereas, the focus of the people I buy from is local people (and therefore they charge local prices--not prices inflated just because you're a foreigner). The best way to get veggies from the above people is to make a trip out here--I don't see any other way but the Veggie Van guy could be an option for some--still looking for the other supplier I mentioned before...man, I misplaced his number and I am having a heck of a time retrieving it.

But, if anyone is interested in making a weekend trek out here...strawberry picking season at the organic farms is coming up--I picked some last year and they were beautiful! I'm always available to provide directions.

:gl:
 
My baby is 9 months old and I usually use frozen vegetables for his food. I have read that it can be just as good. I also find it cheaper to do it that way- less goes to waste.

As far as meat- once it's cooked you should be able to freeze it even if it was frozen before. The bacteria should have been killed when you cooked it.
 
MLBW - let me know when berry picking season is!! I LOOOVVVEE berries and would so go with you!! Sounds like fun!!
 
MLBW, i think that you've hit the nail on the head. The biggest problem these smaller operators have is not knowing how to or bothering with marketing, to foreigners anyway. There's absolutely no doubt that they'd sell more if people actually knew they existed!
 
Nicole--No problem, you've got my didgets!

Aussiegal--Yeah, well...for example with the Chen family--I don't think the mom is literate--so if you haven't made it beyond the 6th grade it's pretty hard to know about marketing, right? (It took her a good while to write down their phone number--and some of the numbers are written upside down or backward). But, they do have a deep relationship with their land--their land is kind of like another family member--you can really tell!
 
Thanks MLBW you have provided me with a wealth of info about buying organic straight from the local farmers. I will be going to the Organic Vegetable Market at Star Ferry Pier tomorrow and also ordering from the Organic Garden Veggie Van :)
 
Also MLBW can you tell me when is the Strawberry picking? I would so LOVE to come over but on a weekday. I would so want my 11 month old daughter to be as close to nature as possible although in a place like HK is hard to do :(
 
What an interesting thread, it has provided for some great reading.

Just wanted to say thank you to MLBW for your suggestions with the Veggie Van. It really is great that local farmers are trying to be conscious of the quality of the produce they are growing by going organic (and having studied nutrition I am all too aware for the need to eat wholesome fresh vegetables!). Since being in HK I always wonder about where the vegetables I buy and eat come from and about the conditions under which they were grown, harvested and stored in before they reach the supermarket shelves. Being able to buy direct from the farmers is fantastic and at $150 a week for 3kg of veggies is easy on the budget!

:thanks

Also would love to know when/where the strawberry picking is!
 
interesting... i was talking to my cousin about this thread. she is studying geology and ecology at uni. she seems to think that "going organic" is great except for the fact that there is no way on this earth that enough food can be grown to feed the entire planet or even close to it from organicly grown stuff.... she is convinced that organic stuff will remain a luxury with higher prices because of this and it will not go "mainstream"
 
Wow.... I'm glad that my initial question triggered such an interesting discussion! I've learnt alot and will definitely buy organic produce from one of those local farmers suggested by MLBW. Thanks again for all of your insightful comments!
 
carang said:
interesting... i was talking to my cousin about this thread. she is studying geology and ecology at uni. she seems to think that "going organic" is great except for the fact that there is no way on this earth that enough food can be grown to feed the entire planet or even close to it from organicly grown stuff.... she is convinced that organic stuff will remain a luxury with higher prices because of this and it will not go "mainstream"
Click to expand...

But no one knows the future...thankfully! If most people just started a small garden beside their house, nearly everyone would have access to better quality produce (maybe not "certified organic" but...) People in Taiwan do this...nearly everywhere you look someone is growing some sort of vegetable on a plot of land. In HK, not so much... :0)

I think there is a substantial movement, though to cut out all the toxic junk we're dumping on our fields, though. There has got to be a healthier/safer way to grow things. The worldwide economic feasibility of everyone eating truly organic produce still won't keep me from personally exploring other alternatives. :yeah2:yeah2:yeah2:yeah2
 
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