Does your helper stay out late?

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wanfamily

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Just wondering whether I've been a bit naive with my helper. When she came to us, she had had a 'strict' employer (ie 8pm curfew, not allowed to spend the night away etc.) My approach has always been that she is an adult, so I didn't impose any curfew and to be honest, I have encouraged her to go out when she is not on duty as I like the privacy and I believe it to be healthy for her to have her own separate friends etc. I did have a big talk with her about trust at the start ie not getting drunk/ getting involved with the wrong sort of people etc. One of the reasons I liked her is that she seems to be 'naive' and a 'good little Catholic girl'.
For the first few months, she'd just go and visit her sister etc and would usually go out a few times a week and get back around 10ish. In January, her sister got sent back to the Phillipines and I have noticed a change in her habits. She frequently goes out during the week until around 10sih - or and on her day off, she is out all day and sometimes doesn't get back until after midnight.She has also stayed out all night after 'falling asleep at her friend's place - this was the night before her day off, so she didn't miss any work.
At the moment, it's no huge worry as she hardly looks after the kids as I am at home - she starts a 8am, has a few hours off in the afternoon and finishes by 8pm. However, I'll be going back to work in August and she'll be responsible for my 16 month old while I'm working. (I'll probably be posting for advice on this later!!)
On one hand, I want to respect her privacy - she's entitled to her private life . On the other, I'm worried because I'll be needing someone on the ball to look after my kids! She does work hard with clearning and cooking and when she does babysit for the odd hour or so, she is great with the kids, (No signs of hangovers!). However it's a different ball game running around after a toddler all day.
This is my first helper, so I'm interested in your experiences!
Thanks!
 
Hi there, no, ours doesn't go out during the week at all and on Sundays is usually back by around 9 or thereabouts. We have been lucky in that we've not had to lay down any rules as she seems to like a quiet life. We do have two little ones so I am sure she's as tired as we all are by 7 pm!

If I were you, I'd get her to do a bit of night babysitting and that way curtail activities without having to speak to her initially - see how she reacts. Sounds like she's fairly used to being able to take off wherever she wants after 8 pm but once you're back at work you'll need her to be around more and not resent that if you know what I mean. So maybe head out yourself a couple of times a week (without announcing it too much in advance - ie: let her know in the morning that you'll be out for dinner and she'll be listening to the monitor etc). Will be interesting to see if she's annoyed about this or just understands that this is part of her job..
It sounds like she's had a lot of freedom and will have less soon and good to have an adjustment period if you know what I mean..

Hope that helps
 
Have you noticed any change of behaviour from her these few weeks?
I don't know from your case, but for my first helper, after she was given day-offs after three months, she became a completely new person (not nice anymore), she still does her housework, but I noticed that she started talking a lot more on phone and not looking after my son well, her housework was just so-so, later i found out that she started going out with different men on Sundays...( i will even notice her smelling of cigarettes when she came home)
So I just dont know, some helpers are mature enough to know what is right or wrong but some just doesn't. Some of my friends told me that same that once you let them go out, they will meet new ( sometime bad accompanies) and just change completely
 
It's my first time to hire a helper too so I understand that you want her to have some more free time and privacy for yourself too.

In my opinion, going out a few times a week plus day off is a bit too much and coming back home after mid night is not acceptable at all. She might seems to be a 'good little Catholic girl' for now but don't be surprised if she changes quickly. We don't know what kind of people she meets outside and the outside world is very tempting.

I do give my helper some chances to get out of the flat by sending her to the market / supermarket / laundary shop. I am afraid that's all I can offer. I assume that she talks to her friends or have a short gathering during her time out. As long as she does not come back too late (within 2 hours) I am fine with it.

If you want your helper to have more of her free time but you don't want to worry where she goes or comes home late, you might as well hire a part time if possible.
 
I seriously can not believe what I am reading. Honestly it sounds like the memoir I have recently read based during the Japanese invasion of Singapore.....it talks about the treatment of mui chai.....

Honestly, ladies, times have changed! I am appalled at the treatment some helpers get here in Hong Kong.

I think that a lot of people forget that they are "employees" and NOT slaves. Does your boss think it is acceptable for you to have a life outside of work??? Of course they do. Do they mind if you take a personal phone call during work hours that does not disrupt your job performance - of course not.

Please - let these ladies have quality of life. Let them have some dignity. Quite possibly they are more qualified and more intelligent than you! But unfortunately, their country may be too corrupt and poor to generate jobs for them.

In the end if you don't like how your helper keeps your house, do it yourself!....Like most do in the rest of the world who are able to manage the family and employment.

And finally, I find this comment to be absolutely naive and obnoxious!..:

"She might seems to be a 'good little Catholic girl' for now but don't be surprised if she changes quickly."
 
Nope, actually, this comment here takes the cake:

"One of the reasons I liked her is that she seems to be 'naive' and a 'good little Catholic girl'."

Why? Why would you like someone that is naive? So you can take advantage of her?
 
Wow Bumps! Pretty strong stuff there. From what I read, wanfamily is doing what she can to give her helper some space. She is noticing a change in her helper's way of conducting herself and naturally wants to be sure this will not impact how her child is looked after when she returns to work. I can't see anything that suggests that any of these ladies are treating their helpers like 'slaves'!!! Quite the contrary. The remark about naive is, I imagine, based on wanting someone who isn't manipulative or plays games which is what most employers hope for in a helper. Maybe you've misinterpreted wanfamily's use of the word 'naive' but does that then give anyone the right to assume that she wants to take advantage of her helper.

Sandy0741 made a comment about 'alot more phone calls' so you can not compare that to the odd call of a personal nature.

Finally, 'if you don't like how your helper keeps your house, do it yourself!....Like most do in the rest of the world who are able to manage the family and employment.' Actually, no...If you don't like how your helper keeps your house and you want to have a helper, you can look for someone else. I don't see the need to tell somebody how other people in the rest of the world manage to run their homes as if to imply that anybody here is not managing to do so.

The type of person one feels comfortable employing in an office environment is not necessarily the same as the type one would employ at home. A helper shares our home, our personal space, and most importantly, time with our children so it is important that both parties are comfortable and happy with the arrangement, rules of living and working.
 
I think every employer of a helper has different expectations, and of course every helper requires different management. I hired our first helper just over 3 months ago and am very happy with her. I am still learning about different ways of managing our relationship, I like to give her some freedom and relax some rules, but at the same time, like her to remember that I am her boss and want her to maintain certain standards. She is live in, and has Sundays off, and upon hiring her, we never really discussed her going out during week nights. We initially had no 'curfews' as such, but after the first couple of weeks she would leave at 7 in the morning on her day off and come home very late (11 or 12 at night). As our apartment is small, and I am very sensitive to noise, her coming through the door late at night woke and disturbed my husband and I on the Sunday night. She also didn't function too well the next day. As a result, we asked her if she could please ensure she is home by 10pm on Sundays as we are often in bed by this time. She has adhered to this without issue which has been great. During the week, she now occasionally asks if she can go for a walk or visit one of the other helpers in the complex. We are more than happy for her to do so providing she again returns home prior to 10pm. We have found that imposing a curfew has not affected our relationship with our helper.
 
sandy0741 said:
after she was given day-offs after three months, she became a completely new person (not nice anymore),
Click to expand...


i SERIOUSLY hope that something was lost in translation here.... from the sound of this it seems like you didn't give your helper days off for the first 3 months???? not only is that immoral, it is also illegal!

if it was me, you can bet i wouldn't be a nice person any more if i was made to work like a slave for 3 months!!!!!!!!!!!

as for the rest of the post...

meeting new guys?? so long as your helper is single and not working as a prostitute, what does it matter??? did you never date yourself???? come on!

smelling like cigarettes! god forbid! wow, she must have gone someplace just dreadful to come home smelling like cigarettes! aiya! so, she washes her clothes and has a shower! problem solved! she doesn't smell like cigarettes anymore!

:wow:
 
to wanfamily:

i would just sit down with her and have a talk. say, that you understand she's met friends and is having fun, but that you would appreciate a telephone call if she will be home after 9pm, just so you don't worry. explain that once you start working, you might like to limit the number of nights out just so that you are sure she gets enough rest. that you wouldn't want her to get sick because you will be working and won't be around to help out if she does.

keep it adult and civilised. remember that so far as i can tell, she is still acting responsibly. after all, 10pm isn't very late.
 
To clarify: day-offs after 3 months: I think that means the labour holidays. According to the law, if the helper has worked with the same employer for 3 consecutive months, she is entitled for the labour holidays.
 
like i said, i REALLY hope that somethign was lost in translation.

even so, when my helper started (5 days before i gave birth via emergency c-section) i still gave her the CNY holidays paid...my son was born on the 4 day of CNY...

it's really such a small amount of money, something like $135/day that i would feel like a rotten scrooge not to pay her... seems very petty to me.
 
To clarify: the discourse in the initial 4 posts was appalling and warranted "strong stuff!"
 
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Sorchului
I'm not sure if this is what you meant, but your helper is entitled to statutory holidays within the first 3 months. She is however not entitled to be paid for the statutory holiday until after she has worked for 3 months. This is in sections 39 and 40 of the Employment Ordinance. So she was entitled to the statutory holidays off even within the first 3 months.
 
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Thank you for your comments. My main reason for posting was because I am new to this helper thing and wanted to see what your experiences were. Maybe there there was something lost in translation - I am more concerned about my own naivity of the situation as I have never had a helper before. When my helper came she told me that her last employer imposed rules etc to 'protect her'. I decided it was not my style to impose rules as she is entitled to do what she likes in her private time. My concerns are as follows:
1) Should I be more 'responsible' for her (ie am I not fulfilling my role as being a caring employer?
2) I am nervous about the change of going back to work, especially as my hubby will be away for 4 months during that time.
I have talked in depth about the changes in routine that will need to happen ( Bumps - It hurt to be accused of taking advantage of anyone - I would NEVER expect my helper to work longer hours than me - at the moment, I get up at 5:30 to take care of the kids, while she starts at 8 - then we work together until the day's work is done . She is absolutely adamant that she wants to stay, evern though I have told her it will be more difficult as she said 'I want to stay with you because it's hard to find a kind employer'.

I liked the advice about getting her into the new routine gradually to avoid resentment and the advice from Cara about talking to her as an adult.Thank you for that.
 
Wanfamily, I did not accuse, I asked. There was a question mark there. Again, my retorts lie in the fact that I did not gel with the language and content used. Perception is reality.
 
Ha ha - easy to miss stuff when you are skim reading enroute to the nappy drawer. 'Nuff said - signing off now lest hackles be raised.
 
I know a chinese family who haven't given a single day off to their helper in the last 10 months since they have hired her. Not even sundays !!! I am sure the helper knows what the rules are since she has worked in HK for many years for a previous employer. So it seems she is happy to work like a slave. I asked her employer why she doesn't get a day off and the reply was that the agency would have told them if there was any such rule as a statutory day off. I am sure the employer knows there is such a rule (Everyone does) but prefer her not going out and instead work for them on Sundays while they sit and watch TV.
Wanfamily you are not being unfair AT ALL!!!
 
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