Advice from Working Mums

M

mel_g20

Registered User
I would really appreciate some advice/feedback from mums who work, about what life is like being a working mum.

I love my kids to bits, but I am becoming increasingly unfulfilled being a stay at home mum and think it is time to start thinking about what I need, which I think will mean returning to work mostly full time.

I am however filled with significant apprehension that I do not believe my husband understands. My husband has a demanding job, and before kids I was quite career orientated. I have alot of worries about how I can be a good parent and give my kids a secure upbringing if I also return to work full time. On the otherhand I also need to be happy... so I would be really interested to understand what hours other working mums work, how they balance parenting with working, how they share the parenting with their husband with both parents working, how the kids are benefiting/or not.

I have many many questions, but as a start I would love your feedback and to get a discussion going.

Thanks in advance.
 
Hi mel

I was in the same boat as you. Before kids I had a very demanding job and was working very long hours and a lot of weekends. I am a lawyer and although I knew I didn't want to push for partnership, I still wanted to achieve my goals and work hard at work.

When I had my first child (now 2) I knew that I couldn't do the long hours and weekends anymore and nor did I want to. I love having my helper and she does a great job but I wanted to play a large role in bringing up my kids and I didn't need to work fulltime for the money (but did need to work part time for the money). I was VERY lucky in that my work was willing to help me create a new part time role for myself so that I could do 9 - 6pm three days a week. I am now on maternity leave for number 2 but am due to return to my 3 day role in April. I know that I need something else in my life and would go around the bend being at home all the time. Everyone is different but I feel I have worked hard at uni and then 10 years as a lawyer and I couldn't throw that all away (in my job it is difficult to take a long break and then return to it). Also, we have our own financial goals for being in HK and I need to work to achieve that. If I didn't work then it would not be worth it financially for us to stay in HK. So, even though I don't have much of a choice, I still enjoy the balance that I have with part time fulfilling work combined with 4 days at home with the kids. If I had not been able to work part time in my current role then I would likely not have worked despite the financial goals as I knew that a full time 5 day a week role would have been more than 40 hours a week (more like 80 - 100 hours a week at times - usually including weekends too) which was not conducive to having a role in raising my kids. If yours would be a regular 40 hour week and only 5 days a week (not weekends) then that makes a difference.

My husband works flexible hours so is able to have a lot of input in the upbringing of our kids too so I am fortunate there.

Since my kids are so young (2 and 8 weeks) they realise that Mummy is away (although my 2 year old is going through a real Mummy Mummy phase) so are fine with me being away. That may get harder as they get older.

HK is at least a lot easier for childcare in that you can afford to have someone you know and your kids know to look after them in your own home. In my home country they would have to go to a creche and that would make it harder for me than leaving them at home.

It is a big decision but I totally understand where you are coming from. Any other questions, please let me know.

SB2
 
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This is a really interesting topic which I have thought a lot about too.....I too am a lawyer who used to have a job where I was on call 24 hours a day, 365 days a year and working 80-100 hour weeks was the norm. But prior to my marriage and having my son, who is now 11 months old, I got out of that and took a huge pay cut to work in the non-profit sector - also doing legal work. In this new job, I work 9-6, Monday to Friday and really rarely do I have to take work home or work on weekends. I am lucky in that my work also has a great maternity leave policy and not only did I get 4 months off after the birth of my child but I also got to work reduced hours (9-4) until my son was 9 months old. If I was still doing my old 100 hour a week job, I don't think I would have continued working. I would not have been able to be a good mom if I had kept that job, I think. So one thing to consider when returning to work is whether or not you would be able to get a part-time job or if you can get a job where the hours are reasonable, flexible and where you can "turn off" when you go home to concentrate on your family. Unfortunately in many jobs in the legal and finance sector, you can't just "turn off" when you go home.

People always asked me when I first returned to work if I missed my son (which is always a big issue for stay at home moms preparing to return to work) - and I will have to honestly say that I really had no separation issues and was even glad to go back to work because I really enjoy what I do. I think it helped a lot to know that I had a great nanny at home who I trust completely to look after my son. It also helped that I'm the one that changes his nappy and feeds him first thing in the morning before I go to work and I also knew that as soon as I got home, I would be the one to look after my son until he went to bed, so I did have a few quality hours with him each day. So I think that in preparation to go back to work, it is important to make sure that your have good child care options and you won't spend a lot of time worrying about what your child is up to while you are at work.

However, as my son gets older and as he starts to go to school, I think I will have to re-evaluate whether or not I still want to continue to work. When my son comes home from school, I want to be the one he comes to with all the exciting news about what happened in school. I want him to come to me to ask questions about things he had learned at school. I think it is actually more important to spend more time with school-age children. But I guess I have another year to decide if I am willing to give up my work.....

Anyways, it really is a big decision to make and a lifestyle adjustment. Good luck with your decision!!
 
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HI all

This is a really interesting thread and it seems like there are lots of us in the same boat. I too am a lawyer with two children (2 yo and 4 months old) and am just back at work from mat leave. With my first one, I was fortunately able to renegotiate my role and have a 4 day working week , which was an absolute lifesaver as it means I don't have to work weekends.

Mel, you don't say how old your children are, but I found it a lot easier once my 2 yo started pre-Nursery as I knew he'd be happily occupied for half the day and would be quite happy hanging out and playing in the afternoon. What I try to do is arrange playdates that my helper can take them to, and it also helps that my husband comes home earler some days of the week.

I must say that the times that I miss being at home more are not the times when the kids are happiest, but when we've had discipline issues with the 2yo. My helpers are great, but one of them in particular had a tendency to spoil the children and the 2 yo was noticeably a lot more whiney when she was around. We have to work quite hard in ensuring that some basic house rules are adhered to.

Like futureHKmum I think it'll become more important to be around when the kids are at primary school age and I'm telling myself that I have to work hard and save up so that I can step away from work then if need be!

good luck!
 
It's an interesting thread and I'd also like to share with other working mums. I have a 9-month old at home, am a 1st time mother. Since I was pregnant I wish I could just quit my job and be a full-time mommy but the reality (financial reality) doesn't allow. Many people told me that I'd get bored/stuck with being with a baby all day and regret of losing my career. I have just spent 11 full days with my baby and I enjoyed every moment with him. I want more! Having said so, I won't hide the fact that it is indeed more 'exhausting' to look after a baby/toddler than working all day in the office. It's a lot happier to be with my baby.

Well, I work full time, I leave the house at 7:30am and arrive back home, the earliest, 7:15pm. 12 hours away from my son five days a week. Sats & Suns are the highlights of my week cos' I can be with my son. My mum & dad help look after my son and I don't have a helper. I know my mom&dad would look after their grandson so well that I shall have no worries but I do miss my son awful lot!

How do I balance career and child upbringing? I am lucky to have a husband who is willing to take care of all the household chores, as such I can pay full attention at looking after our son. Every evening I come home, I talk/cuddle/play/sing to my son while my husband does the cooking. I put my son to bed around 9pm~930pm so we have 2 'precious' hours with him every evening. Sat & Sun is lovely cos' I am literally spending whole day with my son and husband is given more opportunity to be with the son at the weekends. We take our son to a playgroup every Sat and we will have a family outing afterwards. Sun is normally spent at home or sometimes with relatives/friends.

My son is supposed to be more attached to my mom (as my mom looks after him five full days in a week) but amazingly my son is actually very attached to me. I guess it's probably because I am always the last one he sees before he goes to bed and the first one he sees when he wakes in the morning. And I am always the one to comfort him or give him a big cuddle whenever he wakes during the night in tears or in distress. Whenever I am with him, I sing songs to him, play with his little fingers, tell him stories, massages him, feed him, change his nappy... I guess he likes mommy as his little Comfort Shelter.

Physically speaking, it's pretty hard to balance working and parenting I must admit, unless I go to bed with him by 9:30pm. But how often can I really go to bed that early unless I am ill? The time after 9:30pm is the time either for me to catch up with the news, to read a book, or to share with my husband. I always try to go to bed around 11pm then hopefully I will have 7 hours sleep. Don't forget I need to get up before 6:30am to get ready for work. If my son sleeps though the night I can go to work the next day with pretty good spirits. Otherwise, like in the recent two weeks he wakes every two hours, I feel terrible in the morning and carry a stinking headache to work! It's really, really hard!

I think it may make some difference on the daily routine when he starts nursery school?!? How does he benefit from having two full-time working parents? I don't know yet...and I will see...

So far I think I make a fair balance between career and parenting. The key point I think is I do spend some quality time with my son whenever time allows. To sound a bit extreme, I spend all my non-working hours with him and pay all my attention to him whenever he's awake.

I tend to agree that it is more important to be with your child when they start primary school till they pass their teenage. Those 10 years (from 6 ~ 16) is the crucial, in my view. But, the chance for me to quit my job and stay home is barely impossible, unless I win a lottery~~
 
I'm in the same boat as Ox_Jess unless of course we head back. But I have no family here so my child is left with a helper between 12-6 p.m.

I could always head back to our home country. But, as I have learnt from many other women that I know, having your own career and financial independence is very important. And this is one of the best places (my workplace) I have worked in.

I divide whatever free time I have between my child and my personal needs. I usually try to combine the two. We have Saturday morning mummy days... we head for breakfast just the two of us and hang out and chat. Every evening we spend about two hours together doing whatever he is interested in. Sunday is strictly family day. No computers, no TV just two parents and their child mucking around.

Working in HK can be rough if you don't have an understanding employer. I work for one of the best. She understands when I need to take a sickie here and there or simply take time off to attend little things like my child's school picnic. In return, I do my best at work so that my department runs like a well-oiled machine. It's a give and take between my employer and I.
Don't think about returning to work if you cannot find a company that will not support your family needs. I'm about to have No. 2 in Sept. and we are thinking of moving closer to work so that I can head home to breastfeed at lunch and bond for a little over an hour with my new bub after maternity leave is over. She knows that and has no issues with it. My boss has encouraged me to take as much time off as I need during this pregnancy. I truly appreciate how rare this quality is in an employer in HK. All my co-workers are supportive and are willing to take on some of my regular responsibilities so that I can have this 'HK baby'!

Sometimes though, working and mothering can be overwhelming and on those days, I take a total time out for a few hours by myself with a girlfriend to have a meal or watch a movie.

My husband works less hours than I do so is at home more often. So he does contribute quite a bit in taking care of our child. We don't need to split the housework as we have a helper. We take turns with the nightly reading, bath time, ... any daily routine that involves our child.

It is hard to go back to work after having a child... but you get used to it and find a routine around the quirks of being a working mum. Having friends who are working mothers helps too as no one understands the trials and tribulations more!

Sometimes it's sad that my helper hears about his bad day first. But, I make it a point to ring home everyday after his lunch to find out how his day went so that I don't really miss out.
 
Agree with Quasimother, working for a company that supports working mothers and offers flexible scheduling is key.

I have two kids (11 months and 2.5 years) and work in banking for a global organisation that (has to be) commited to diversity.

I agreed with my boss that I could re-engineer my working day to support my family needs. My role is global so much of my work is in the evenings anyway.

I get in around 9.30 after putting the baby down for his first nap, usually take a short lunch or work through and leave at 5.45 latest. I have a black out zone from 6-8pm during which time no-one is allowed to call me. I am online again from 8.30 ish to finish work and take calls. Friday's I work from home, Tuesday afternoons from 3pm I also take off for a baby class.

I am not working less hours, just differently - they definitely still get their pound of flesh!

It was hard leaving both kids at first (a little easier with the second) but I do get a tremendous amount of satisfaction from my job.

Having amazing helpers, a husband working flexible hours also, always getting the kids up / putting them to bed and keeping weekends strictly for family all combine to create a sense of balance for me.
 
work life balance

Thanks so much for all your replies.

In my case my children are 3 and 5, my eldest is in the first year of primary and the youngest the first year at preschool. My ideal job would be parttime, however as I look around this seems to be highly unlikely. I am in Financial Services Marketing. So faced with not working at all my only option would be to apply for full time jobs. I am trying to look for something which will allow me a 9 to 6 day - but again I'll just have to see. You are right though that the company must be supportive of a work life balance.

This still feels me with a tremendous sense of guilt and concern for my childrens wellbeing. My husband has a challenging job, and if I work would not be flexible to take on more responsibility for the children. In fact I know he doesnt want to. However being a full time mum is not something that I think is good for me. This would mean the helper would take on more, which I just find a little difficult. Not because I dont trust her, just because I think some things are a parents job. Unfortunately my husband and I dont not agree on this. If I wasnt living in HK then we wouldnt have a helper at all.

I want to make sure my children have after school playdates with their friends and I worry that they will miss out if I am not there to meet other mums. It would be down to my helper to take them.

I also enjoy dropping them of and meeting them from school, I find these to be special times. But maybe I need to think about this differently. Maybe if I work you something create other special times with your children? I dont know. Were you all apprehensive before you started work, and then found ways to make it work for you and your children?
 
I have the same feelings/dilemma. I've only been off work for about 1.5 year and was working for finance/ibanks. Have been thing hard about what jobs I can get in the field that would have reasonable hours but no good answer yet!
 
Never had Mommy Daydreams

Personally, I never dreamed of being a mommy full-time. That doesn't mean I didn't want to have children at all--it's just that I never daydreamed about being a SAHM.

But, I felt a social obligation to be a SAHM--based on my upbringing and what others around me were doing. I was a SAHM for a full year (son is now 2) and it was absolutely the most difficult year of my life so far.

I didn't want to go back to work because I was stubborn and kept saying to myself, "I have to do this. I have to stick this out. I should be doing this. I shouldn't let a helper 'raise my child' etc."

But, in the end, I gave in a little bit and started working part-time. It turns out that it was one of the wisest decisions I have made.

Before baby I was a journalist working for a newspaper and writing for other publications--that was my education and my background. I had already been in journalism for 7 years and it was (and still is somewhat) my passion.

After baby, I did go back to journalism but that career didn't mesh as well with the family life I wanted so I started teaching. Now, I have the best of both worlds because I teach communication and journalism which I find rewarding. I teach part-time. This means I sacrifice some of the perks and financial pluses but in the end it also means I have a flexible schedule and am available for my son much more than I would be if I was working full-time in my original career.

I can still pursue writing and I'm still involved in that arena but it is somewhat on the back burner. I bring in extra income for our family and to me, working outside the home is more productive and effective than going to therapy--for me work is therapeutic and for that reason alone it's so healthy that I went back to work.

I am a MUCH better mother and wife just by working part-time.
 
i agree 110%! i LOVE being a mum, but i KNOW i'm a better mum because i work. i know myself well enough to know that although i love spending time with my kids i would go crazy if it was for an indefinite period of time. i enjoy every minute of it when my helper goes away or when i take the kids to canada on my own. BUT, i love it so much partly because i know i'll be getting back to work soon.

for me, i changed from running my small beauty salong and teaching privately to openning my own playgroup centre. when i openned it, neither of my kids was going to school, but by next september, both of my kids will be in school full-time. i'm planning on expanding my business (hopefully) by then.

because i run my own business, i spend the vast majority of my time working from home doing admin and planning. i still teach some of the classes, but since i've hired a wonderful part-time teacher to take some of the stress out of my week, i've been enjoying my life even more than normal.
 
It was hard in the first year. I went back to work just a little less than 6 months after birth. It almost broke me. I was also in a job I did not like. Now, however, it is different. I love my job and the people i work with. I'm now pregnant with my second child and the support I am getting is WAAAAAY better than even back home.

Every school holiday, I get the experience of being a stay at home mum and by the end of it, I desperately want to go back to work! This was very much evident when I had to stay at home for 2.5 weeks during the last CNY break.

My current job stimulates my mind. Keeps me sane with adult conversation not just idle chit chat or kid-talk. This has definitely made me a better mum. Going back to work too doesn't mean you need to go back to what you were doing before. So I agree with Thanka2.

I do make sure that my child and I have special moments together. He knows the days and refers to them as mummy and ... days. These moments are so precious to me. My colleague who has grown up with a working mum had days like that too with his mum and he said that those days/moments have carried on from when he was little. So imagine the future... your children and you... when they're teenagers, adults... continuing this tradition with you not because you want but because they want to. This keeps me going.
 
This is a really interesting thread and it's good to know that there are other working mums out there. I am a lawyer by trade and have two children (8 months and 26 months). I have had 8 months maternity leave for each baby (very lucky I know) and return to work after baby number 2 in 2 weeks.

In my view the keys to making it work are:

- working part time if at all possible. I am very lucky that I can work only 3 days per week.

- if that's not possible working flexible hours in the manner that LeahH has described.

- having an understanding boss who realises that you may need time off for family issues from time to time. My boss has 5 young kids so knows what it is like to be woken up at night!

- having a great helper or nanny who you trust implicitly and who your children adore. My helper is fantastic and my son and daughter love her so I know they receive the best of care whilst I am at work.

- acknowledging that you probably won't be on the same career trajectory as your were previously and making peace with this (others might disagree with me on this one). This was very difficult for me as I used to be a very ambitous person. However, I work in the front office banking role and I simply can not compete anymore when I only work 3 days a week, leave a 5.30 and don't do any work travel. I have accepted that I may not be promoted again until I am using a zimmer frame whilst my colleagues who are willing to work the long hours and do the travel will be promoted ahead of me. In a few years I will be working for colleagues who used to work for me.

- making an effort to be the "Comfort Shelter" for your baby (as Ox Jess said) - i.e be the one that comforts him at night and when he is sick.

- acknowledging and accepting that you won't really have any "me time". Between working and spending time with my children I don't have any time left. I even feel guilty if I go to the supermarket without taking one of them and I won't tell you how long it has been since I have had a haircut!!
 
This is indeed a great thread - thanks for posting it! So many former lawyers! I'm a lawyer by trade as well - one of those 100 hour work-week types, and an expat at a US law firm - no other ties to HK and don't speak the language of the locals. Even though my firm offers part-time for the first year I return from maternity leave (which will be in a few months), I already know from talking to others that that version of part-time is not going to work and quite honestly, I'll probably be laid off within the year if I tried to hold them to the part-time schedule.

My question is - how did you guys find jobs in HK that worked for you? I wouldn't even know how to begin a job search out here. And for anyone that went back to work after taking a year or more away to take care of your bundle of joy, were employers understanding about your absence or was it held against you? Thanks!
 
I can really relate to everything you're saying. I am an accountant with a Big 4 firm and 6 years ago was one of the first part-timers in China or HK in our very large organisation. To start with it was all very under the table, don't tell anyone, etc. Now it seems to be a bit more accepted, although there still aren't many part timers and those that are, are usually expats. There are no part time partners and it was made very clear to me that partnership is not an option if I am working part time.

Some things I've learned along the way:
* whether part time works totally depends on your boss. Some are accomodating and don't care, so long as you get the work done. Others are more high maintenance and need you in the office 24/7.
* 3 days is easier than 4 days. In 4 days you are given a full time workload. In 3 days you are given an almost full time work load. Having said that, I'm working 4 days now, and yes, it is very full on.
* My work colleagues (all full time) joke that the only part time about my job is the salary, because I do the same amount of work as them.
* If you are part time you need to be 110% focused on the job when you're there. There is no slacking off, no Starbucks runs, no long lunches. You really need every minute to get the work done and get out at a decent hour.
* After being very career minded, it is hard to step back and accept that I'm never going to be promoted. It is hard to see others get ahead of you (especially people you've trained). I can't help feeling let down by this. I am the same person I was before I had children - the same qualifications, experience, ability and potential. The only difference is that I don't have the same amount of time to devote to work. Having said that, I see female partners with young children and don't want their life. They say they are connected to their children, but really, they aren't. They are kidding themselves, although I'd never say that to them.
* I've gone from client facing work to an internal role and that makes the balance easier. The work is more predictable.
* You need to be flexible and move your days off around to suit the business.
* My company would never employ an outsider part time. You would need to work full time for at least a few years to prove yourself then make a business proposal for working part time.

Even with the downsides, I absolutely recommend part time work. It is totally worth it to touch base with other parents at school, the teachers and do drop off and pick up. My girls really look forward to it.

I also strongly believe that all mums need to be able to support their families. Even if your husband earns a good income, there may come a time when he is sick, unemployed, etc. Financial security is everyone's responsibility.
 
Hear hear for everything said, especially that said by Jane. I work part time in a law firm and can identify with everything she said except that there aren't any female partners with children in the Hong Kong office. (Or if they are, they certainly don't do anything with them because no one knows about them!) It's Friday night on my day off, and I'm working!

There are far fewer options for family-friendly work in Hong Kong than in other countries, but, judging by this thread, I'm actually quite surprised at the number of women there are who have been able to find semi-suitable jobs. I guess the message is that they do exist so don't give up!
 
I'm a full time working mum and have struggled with the fact that I have to/ought to forget my ambitious side. I work for a very traditional HK company and which does not have great benefits or family-friendly policies. I was very lucky to have landed this job when pregnant - I joined them in my last trimester. The job itself has turned out not the right fit for me - not challenging and practically zero advancement prospects. Because I am able to do the job with my eyes shut, I get to leave work on time and have very few work obligations outside of work hours. If not for my baby (almost one), I would have moved on. Recruiters started calling me when i returned from maternity leave (???) and I re-live this dilemma each time I get a call. My friends in the high-flying jobs that I aspire to tell me frankly that they have very little time for their children, which admittedly sounds unattractive. My priority at this time is my baby, but honestly, is it possible to have it all: career and baby??
 
TheQuasimother said:
I do make sure that my child and I have special moments together. He knows the days and refers to them as mummy and ... days. These moments are so precious to me. My colleague who has grown up with a working mum had days like that too with his mum and he said that those days/moments have carried on from when he was little. So imagine the future... your children and you... when they're teenagers, adults... continuing this tradition with you not because you want but because they want to. This keeps me going.
Click to expand...

I hadn't thought of that but this really encourages me. Thanks for sharing. Every opportunity can be one for a memory, right?
 
lisa88 said:
My priority at this time is my baby, but honestly, is it possible to have it all: career and baby??
Click to expand...

I think with some careers, it's not possible to "have it all"--if you want to do right by your family (i.e. be intimately involved in your childrens' lives). As some have pointed out--HK is definitely not the most family-friendly city in the world. So, the high flying corporate careers that require you to invest blood, sweat and tears in order to climb the ladder (which are many here in HK) probably aren't your best bet if you want a career. Having said that, I think there is always a way if you're creative to get most of what you want--and sometimes that means changing what you want. :)
 
This thread is really interesting as I am a new mommy with a 3mth old baby. I have returned to my full time job working as Compliance in banking and I kept on thinking if i should continue the full time work as I really miss my little one.

As many of you already reveals, being a full time working mom is difficult to juggle between work and family. It is also my thought to work part time but it is really a difficult task exp in the banking sector.
I am also wondering where/any channels to get part time work which i can spend more time with my baby as well as not requiring to quit job forever, even it is not a bank related job anymore... would be grateful to hear some of your opinions...
 
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